CLASS TESTS IN SS

[DarkLink64 921]

I think I can finally pass the torch. 

Perhaps I do not have much more use here! haha

 

If you're proposing a lot of data, I think you should post the evidence of how you collected it. To be more accurate and realistic, i would record all play sessions and post them on Youtube, so, who is viewing can be sure that the play test was done properly and playing with current meta. To make sure each class is being played the best way it could, not just fooling around.

For example, I would contribute with both my MS and KS. But how I would do it:

I have a KS 155 with 138 2 H Sword +24 perfect, but still with 140 +22 defensive items, with Draxos Boot, 140 Bsol Gauntlet and Bracelets. Set boss 3 Bsol.
My MS is 151  with also a 2 H Sword +24 perfect alongside a bow 138 + 24 Perfect. Same defensive configuration of my KS, 140 +22 defensive items, however, without Draxos Boots. But, a more offensive side on accessories: Both Hell Gauntlets and Bracelets Bsol. Also I do have a Claw 138 + 22 Perfect.

Ideally the game shouldn't be played with someone tanking for him. That includes a pet. I was one of the players who suggested that Shadow Sanctuary shouldn't be played with pets, for the very same reasons everyone is complaining - to reduce the power of Ranged characters.

I would test:

KS without any kind of external resources(Virtual Life, Divine Force) and tanking - 5 sessions for each main 1v1 skill - Grand Cross and Double Crash. Then, using his Devine Piercing and Lightning Sword whenever they're up.

Same test above, with external resources. Then, same test above, without external resource and someone tanking. And finally, with external resource and with tanking.


So, with Mechanician, I would do it the same setups, but with greater variety:

Maximize (using 2 Handed Sword), Maximize(using 1 handed weapon like Claw), Metal Armor 2H, Metal Armor 1H, then, finally, AutoMech.

This way we can be fair at all spectrums - not only gut AutoMech, but rather make his other options viable or on par with everyone else.

[Palhacitos 480]

 

6 hours ago, Clem said:

 

Since someone asked me, I tried with MS 149 + Tank & skill automation lvl 9. Thats is to say from 200% DMG boost to 180%. Also Atk speed from 6 to 5.

As we can see, the difference is really low and they still stay the top killer.

 

 

 

 Automation

Level	Dmg Boost	Added Atk Spd	Cool down	MP Usage	STM Usage	Upgrade Fee
9	180%	5	11.5 seconds	48	58	18,200
10	200%	6	12.5 seconds	51	60	19,600

 

we saw that the skill of MS in lvl 9 is 5 of atk speed +  dmg boost 180%.

 

I suggest changing Skill Automation in this way:

Dmg Boost

200% > 170%

Added Atk Spd

6 > 5

MP Usage

48 > 44

STM Usage

60 > 55

 

 

40 minutes ago, DarkLink64 said:

 

I think if he does another test, he will be sick. haha.
better let him rest. ?

Edited May 12, 2020 by Palhacitos

[larousse 21]

I would say nice effort, but the work and data...hmm not that good to be reliable. 

 

Those numbers are really odd for some classes and I think you can put the count on gameplay. Combo skills etc...

 

I agree with @DarkLink64 on the video thing. It's more work, I know, but then you can analyse correctly. 

 

For autoMS is easy, just buff skill and shift + click, then you can have those numbers more precisely but the rest you have too many variables and I bet it's not accurate. 

 

I think autoMS is not the problem here: 

 

By looking the table you can easily see that the main difference is the ROCK timing and DEMOS timing in some cases. If you just fix that time to everyone near to the MS time you will get a balanced killing average and XP.

 

Please, can you provide the .xlsx file so some people can simulate some data?

 

Anyway congratz for taking the time @Clem! 

 

Thank you!

 

Cheers

[-Enigma- 190]

3 hours ago, Palhacitos said:

 

 

 Automation

Level	Dmg Boost	Added Atk Spd	Cool down	MP Usage	STM Usage	Upgrade Fee
9	180%	5	11.5 seconds	48	58	18,200
10	200%	6	12.5 seconds	51	60	19,600

 

we saw that the skill of MS in lvl 9 is 5 of atk speed +  dmg boost 180%.

 

I suggest changing Skill Automation in this way:

Dmg Boost

200% > 170%

Added Atk Spd

6 > 5

MP Usage

48 > 44

STM Usage

60 > 55

 

 

I think if he does another test, he will be sick. haha.
better let him rest. ?

 

I agree with you. change a skills automation T2 of Mech 170% dmg boost and 5 atk speed looks good and fair.

 

With the information on this topic, now the GM will have concrete data ... something he needs to do:

 

Decrease automation (170% dmg boost and 5 atk speed).

 

Or increase all other classes considerably.

 

Hugs!

Edited May 12, 2020 by -Enigma-

[DarkLink64 921]

And a quick opinion:

To me, 1v1 hunting should be kite based. No fucking pets, neither someone tanking.

In order to do so:

Aggro System:

Monsters have a better "who should I target" - aka Aggro - system. Currently it is very basic - target whoever is closest to him, or, a Compulsion flag that tells the monster to follow the last mechanician who used Compulsion.

How the Aggro System should work: Aggro Priority level. Monsters will focus however pulled more priority. And priority is primary decided following this rule:

1- Compulsion
2- Damage dealt
3- Closest inside Sight range

 

Each player has an Aggro level that ranges from 0 to 100.

 

The player that is closest to the monster has a priority of 1. Once someone else gets more close to the monster, the previus player get his priority level reduced back to 0. The "closest inside Sight range" priority should be a multipler, based on a per-monster settings. So it could be fine tuned for specific scenarios like Death Island Party Quest, where sometimes the monsters spawns and die focusing a Mechanician, even the Mechanician itself without having Compulsion up again. Also the Sight range aggro level could be added based on the time a player was kept the closest on the monster, so it outpaces the damage dealt priority.

 

Compulsion automatically sets the priority level to 100, but once the Mechanician gets too far away, the Compulsion priority is removed. Compulsion priority level could also have a expiration time, where it's duration is a multiplier set on the monster itself.

Damage dealt in % is also added to the aggro priority level. Each 1% of HP taken, is 1 point of priority level added to a player.


In that cenario, depending on the Closest inside Sight range multiplier, it doesnt matter if a mule character or a Mechanician is using compulsion for someone else to kill a monster.

For example, in Shadow Sanctuary, I would set:

All monsters:
Compulsion duration multiplier: 0,1
Sight range per second: 0,1
Sight range multiplier: 1


Then, on that scenario, Monster will obviously go to the nearest player when it spawn, but as soon as someone else dealt more than 1% of HP damage, monster will run towards who attacked him. Compulsion would work but last for a very short time.

That way, rangers would have to kite monsters, like true hunters.


Now Kiting itself is something that nobody does on Wartale. Because the game punish who does it, since stopping attacking just kill your DPS. Kiting or orb walking is a tactic where the player attack, run, attack, run. Kiting back is a cenario where a ranged character keeps attacking and running before any melee character can reach him.

I've already suggested on adding a new, completely exclusive feature for Wartale, to promove kiting and more dynamic and active play instead of just shift clicking. That is a full Attack Animation Cancel system.


1. Set cancel penalty and cancel timezones inside an animation time-frame.

Example: Grand Cross animation. It starts from, obviously, Frame 0, and ends on Frame 100.

Penalty Zone will be from Frame 20 to frame 60. Then, Cancel zone goes from last penalty zone +1 (in this example, frame 61) up to frame 65. 

2. How it works?

Issue movement command will cancel an animation. Be it by left clicking or right clicking anywhere on the map or on a given target. The walk/run (therefore movement call) call WILL trigger the animation cancel.
 

3. Rules 

When issuing a movement call MID animation, game checks:

Is it inside the penalty zone?
Yes: - Attack can't be cancelled anymore
No: - Does nothing, but attack can still be cancelled.

Is it inside the Cancel zone?
Yes: - Imediattely cancel animation and count how many frames are left X attack speed(checked in real time) and start a "cancel timer".
No: - Does nohting

 

When Animation is canceled:

Player can swap gears, use potions and move freely, but can't issue default/skill animations. How "cancel timer" works:

Each animation whithin the game has a start and an end frame. Also, it has a BASE speed multiplier, that is, further modified based on buffs and weapon attack speed. Some skills doesnt let weapon attack speed modifiers to change its base speed multiplier.

For example, Grand Cross has 100 frames and a base speed of 30. Each second, 30 frames would be played. Knight Weapon attack Speed and other modifiers, grouped togheter, multiplies this value by 1,3. Final base speed is 39. That means in our example, Grand Cross total animation would be played in 2 seconds plus a few hundreths of a second.

The cancel timer is just the remaining skill frames upon cancelation, still multiplied by the canceled skill BASE speed and it's multipliers. If Grand Cross is canceled on frame 61, there is still roughly a second of canceled animation, where the player SHOULD NOT BE ABLE TO ATTACK AGAIN.

The cancel timer base speed multiplier should be updated in real time - if the player gets slowed or sped up during the cancel timer, the remaining time until the player can attack again should be adjusted accordingly.


This enables maximum DPS while STILL kiting, but, doesn't give an damage advantage of who just simply shift clicks or someone who kites effectively.


This is done on many reasons: 1- prevent spam clicking / autofire abuse. 2- Promote mastering of character each individual skill timming. 3- Get rid of shift clicking boring fest 4- prevent greater damage output than normal.

4. When canceled:

Like stated above, character can't do any offensive animation until the cancel timer runs out. Issuing attacks during the cancel timer will be ignored AND ALSO should not enter in the ingame action queue. Except when inside of a new thing that i would call Queue Leniency.

Queue Leniency:

Could be set how much frames before the final cancel timer runs out, a player can queue attacks. The game has a queue system - if you're using a skill and press 1 to pot at any point, your character will pot as soon as the skill finishes. The same goes if you press W to switch weapons.

The queue leniency should be set to give a bit easier time to queue the next animation as soon as the cancel time runs out, but, at same time, not so easy to let anyone who cancels the skill to instantly queue the next attack.

Example: Grand Cross canceled at frame 65 - still 35 frames left. The Queue Leniency is set to 10 - so, clicking on a target to attack, will not be queued during frames 0 and 25 of cancel timer. If it was on frame 26, the attack will be queued and character will attack right away as soon as the cancel timer runs out.

Holding Click or Shift Click outside of the queue lenicency frame range will be completely ignored and wont make the character attack at all.

Mastering both cancel timming and the expected cancel timer + queue leniency will make the gameplay feel much more tight and active, with multiple inputs per second. At the VERY same time leaving the current gameplay style UNTOUCHED!

So, advanced players could really develop a skill and the game be based on how good a player is at canceling all his actions to gain optmal movement and heal performance, against a player that just shift clicks.


This will be a massive advantage in PvP - besides not allowing higher damage output than shift clicking, it will allow a much higher Heal frequency - a player who succeeds to cancel all his skills, can, theorically, call potion animations, and during potion animations, the cancel timer will run out.

In the end, when potions is taken into consideration, a player who cancels perfectly will have a higher DPS who doesnt.
 

Edited May 12, 2020 by DarkLink64

[Luca 226]

39 minutes ago, DarkLink64 said:

And a quick opinion:

To me, 1v1 hunting should be kite based. No fucking pets, neither someone tanking.

In order to do so:

Aggro System:

Monsters have a better "who should I target" - aka Aggro - system. Currently it is very basic - target whoever is closest to him, or, a Compulsion flag that tells the monster to follow the last mechanician who used Compulsion.

How the Aggro System should work: Aggro Priority level. Monsters will focus however pulled more priority. And priority is primary decided following this rule:

1- Compulsion
2- Damage dealt
3- Closest inside Sight range

 

Each player has an Aggro level that ranges from 0 to 100.

 

The player that is closest to the monster has a priority of 1. Once someone else gets more close to the monster, the previus player get his priority level reduced back to 0. The "closest inside Sight range" priority should be a multipler, based on a per-monster settings. So it could be fine tuned for specific scenarios like Death Island Party Quest, where sometimes the monsters spawns and die focusing a Mechanician, even the Mechanician itself without having Compulsion up again. Also the Sight range aggro level could be added based on the time a player was kept the closest on the monster, so it outpaces the damage dealt priority.

 

Compulsion automatically sets the priority level to 100, but once the Mechanician gets too far away, the Compulsion priority is removed. Compulsion priority level could also have a expiration time, where it's duration is a multiplier set on the monster itself.

Damage dealt in % is also added to the aggro priority level. Each 1% of HP taken, is 1 point of priority level added to a player.


In that cenario, depending on the Closest inside Sight range multiplier, it doesnt matter if a mule character or a Mechanician is using compulsion for someone else to kill a monster.

For example, in Shadow Sanctuary, I would set:

All monsters:
Compulsion duration multiplier: 0,1
Sight range per second: 0,1
Sight range multiplier: 1


Then, on that scenario, Monster will obviously go to the nearest player when it spawn, but as soon as someone else dealt more than 1% of HP damage, monster will run towards who attacked him. Compulsion would work but last for a very short time.

That way, rangers would have to kite monsters, like true hunters.


Now Kiting itself is something that nobody does on Wartale. Because the game punish who does it, since stopping attacking just kill your DPS. Kiting or orb walking is a tactic where the player attack, run, attack, run. Kiting back is a cenario where a ranged character keeps attacking and running before any melee character can reach him.

I've already suggested on adding a new, completely exclusive feature for Wartale, to promove kiting and more dynamic and active play instead of just shift clicking. That is a full Attack Animation Cancel system.


1. Set cancel penalty and cancel timezones inside an animation time-frame.

Example: Grand Cross animation. It starts from, obviously, Frame 0, and ends on Frame 100.

Penalty Zone will be from Frame 20 to frame 60. Then, Cancel zone goes from last penalty zone +1 (in this example, frame 61) up to frame 65. 

2. How it works?

Issue movement command will cancel an animation. Be it by left clicking or right clicking anywhere on the map or on a given target. The walk/run (therefore movement call) call WILL trigger the animation cancel.
 

3. Rules 

When issuing a movement call MID animation, game checks:

Is it inside the penalty zone?
Yes: - Attack can't be cancelled anymore
No: - Does nothing, but attack can still be cancelled.

Is it inside the Cancel zone?
Yes: - Imediattely cancel animation and count how many frames are left X attack speed(checked in real time) and start a "cancel timer".
No: - Does nohting

 

When Animation is canceled:

Player can swap gears, use potions and move freely, but can't issue default/skill animations. How "cancel timer" works:

Each animation whithin the game has a start and an end frame. Also, it has a BASE speed multiplier, that is, further modified based on buffs and weapon attack speed. Some skills doesnt let weapon attack speed modifiers to change its base speed multiplier.

For example, Grand Cross has 100 frames and a base speed of 30. Each second, 30 frames would be played. Knight Weapon attack Speed and other modifiers, grouped togheter, multiplies this value by 1,3. Final base speed is 39. That means in our example, Grand Cross total animation would be played in 2 seconds plus a few hundreths of a second.

The cancel timer is just the remaining skill frames upon cancelation, still multiplied by the canceled skill BASE speed and it's multipliers. If Grand Cross is canceled on frame 61, there is still roughly a second of canceled animation, where the player SHOULD NOT BE ABLE TO ATTACK AGAIN.

The cancel timer base speed multiplier should be updated in real time - if the player gets slowed or sped up during the cancel timer, the remaining time until the player can attack again should be adjusted accordingly.


This enables maximum DPS while STILL kiting, but, doesn't give an damage advantage of who just simply shift clicks or someone who kites effectively.


This is done on many reasons: 1- prevent spam clicking / autofire abuse. 2- Promote mastering of character each individual skill timming. 3- Get rid of shift clicking boring fest 4- prevent greater damage output than normal.

4. When canceled:

Like stated above, character can't do any offensive animation until the cancel timer runs out. Issuing attacks during the cancel timer will be ignored AND ALSO should not enter in the action queue leniency.

Queue Leniency:

Could be set how much frames before the final cancel timer runs out, a player can queue attacks. The game has a queue system - if you're using a skill and press 1 to pot at any point, your character will pot as soon as the skill finishes. The same goes if you press W to switch weapons.

The queue leniency should be set to give a bit easier time to queue the next animation as soon as the cancel time runs out, but, at same time, not so easy to let anyone who cancels the skill to instantly queue the next attack.

Example: Grand Cross canceled at frame 65 - still 35 frames left. The Queue Leniency is set to 10 - so, clicking on a target to attack, will not be queued during frames 0 and 25 of cancel timer. If it was on frame 26, the attack will be queued and character will attack right away as soon as the cancel timer runs out.

Mastering both cancel timming and the expected cancel timer + queue leniency will make the gameplay feel much more tight and active, with multiple inputs per second. At the VERY same time leaving the current gameplay style UNTOUCHED!

So, advanced players could really develop a skill and the game be based on how good a player is at canceling all his actions to gain optmal movement and heal performance, against a player that just shift clicks.


This will be a massive advantage in PvP - besides not allowing higher damage output than shift clicking, it will allow a much higher Heal frequency - a player who succeeds to cancel all his skills, can, theorically, call potion animations, and during potion animations, the cancel timer will out.

In the end, when potions is taken into consideration, a player who cancels perfectly will have a higher DPS who doesnt.
 

 

This is amazing but do not know if was possible to implement for Dev team.

[DarkLink64 921]

10 minutes ago, Luca said:

 

This is amazing but do not know if was possible to implement for Dev team.

 

It is indeed. Devs once said that we need something else much more hard and complex in order to focus on animation cancel in the future: Animation blending.

Animation blending would smooth the game as a whole. It's like, instead of a hard jump from any animation to another, the model will smoothly fades one animation into another.

 

[David-Surf 16]

Good Job Clem ????

[-Enigma- 190]

Up

[xxxholic 30]

On 5/12/2020 at 9:15 PM, Clem said:

Hello everyone,

 

Recently the forum has been very active about class balance and more precisely MS. I was the first asking to balance this class with my own playing experience but without proof. 

 

So, I did my own tests (asked by GM too) with EVERY class in game to check the difference between them.  

 

First, I would like to thanks everyone that helped me by sharing me their chars or finding one, I really appreciate it!

 

I know that the staff will announce something soon, but this is the current situation of the game (Even if it’s an average).

So it can be good to take this into consideration for your next features.

 

What’s more, is it possible to stop closing topics please?

Let’s the players give their ideas, sharing their opinion. We are the one that are playing the game.  

I’ll quote the definition of a FORUM : “a meeting or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged.”

Also, it took me ALOT of time to make the tests, suggestions.... 

Thanks in advance.

 

Besides that, I don’t make this test to NERF a class or whatever. Just to balance the game, that’s it. There’s no aim to nerf a class, or at the end people will change to other class. But BALANCING is really needed.

 

HOW DO I PROCESS?

Level used: 15x (From 149 to 155)

Items used: 138 +24 weapon & high-level items with high mix & age.

Force used: Bellum forces 

Map used: Shadow Sanctuary (144)

Party members: Solo

Tanker used : PRS with regen field (wasn’t on the party)

Moobs killed: I killed each moob of the map 4 times and more. Then I make an average of the killing time. The time is in seconds.

 

I made the test like it should be that is to say, using the BEST skill of each class, adapted of each moob.

For example, with KS I was using LS, ATA I was using Twist javelin on demon & soul sucker on moobs…. (applies this on EVERY char)

It’s the real experience from every player in game.

 

MS, AS & ATA –> I used tank since they are not able to tank.

MGS, KS, SS, FS, PS, PRS, ASS –> Tried with and without tank to show the difference.

 

 

RESULTS

 All the numbers are an average. 

I done the tests to make it the most FAIR as possible. It was the only way I had to make it.

Time is in seconds.

 

This is all the class I have tested :

 

 

Considering we all use a tanker (with PRS/MS/PETS/CRYSTALS) :

 

 

Since someone asked me, I tried with MS 149 + Tank & skill automation lvl 9. Thats is to say from 200% DMG boost to 180%. Also Atk speed from 6 to 5.

As we can see, the difference is really low and they still stay the top killer.

 

 

 

AVERAGE TIME KILLING* = The average time killing of each type of mood in SS

EXP(M)*: The exp I gain per moob in SS soloing

AVERAGE EXP PER HOUR 1VS1* = The exp the char get soloing during 1 hour in SS 

DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MS* = Difference of Exp of each class vs MS

AVERAGE % : It's the average % of the killing time of all class vs MS

 

 

ANALYSIS & FEEDBACK

from my personal experience

 

I would like to say, after trying every char that my game experience is based on how many skills I was able to use per class and how the class is tanking. (Making pets & crystals has is should be, should solve the tanking problem)

Example: 

PRS is able to use only vigor ball to kill (& extinction but only on undead), so you don’t have a dynamic while playing, it’s so repetitive. 

Whereas, 

ATA: Vengeance, Twist javelin for demon, Soul sucker, fire javelin…. 

KS have LS, grand cross & more…

PS have poison, dion’s eyes & more….
….

 

--> The staff already made it for Shaman with press deity & for mage with water tornado. It’s a pleasure to play while using some skills. This need to be implemented on more skills. 

 

Rangers VS Melee : As we can see, Rangers & Mgs are the top killers in SS. That's a good point. 

I personaly thinks that MS should stay one of the best killer with Rangers but not with a difference of 21% from Mage. It should be close to others Rangers.

 

MS (auto) : You are able to be the best killer in SS using the cheapest gears of the game.

It’s a class where you have nothing to do, just being semi afk… I must say a boring class. 

You still have more exp than a 16x KS for example.

But it's nice class for those people who want to be able to play without spending a lot of coins in game.

It shouldn't be the best killer in Wartale since is suppose to be a tanker. Maybe a good killer but not the best.  

 

MGS : It’s a nice class where you’re able to use different skills. 

I would love to see death ray back, but it’s because of nostalgia ?

 

AS : You have to use a Tanker to play in SS that is to say to play in dual mode (that I don’t like) since pets die easy & the system is bad there. 

But it’s a good killer in SS, as it should be.

 

ATA : I like to play this class since she has many skills to use, it's a dynamic class.

 

KS : It’s my own class ATM. The best melee class in SS from my tests. The T5 skill LS has nice DMG. 

 

SS : Well, it’s a good class but I never really liked SS (it’s personal). He have good tank abilities. To sum up, it was good to play with this class in Shadow Sanctuary. 

 

FS & PS : Kinda hard to tank sometime, I used to die. Hope their T5 skills will improve them (like KS with LS).

 

ASS : I had the worst experience in game with this char. You deal low DMG and are not able to tank. This class really need something to be done… I saw many nice suggestions about it.

 

PRS : You have to use holy mind on some moobs. It’s a boring class too since it’s repetitive and it take some time to kill a moob (compare to other class)

 

 

PETS & CRYSTALS

I still don’t understand why nothing is made to make this like it SHOULD BE. Everyone agree that is was a useful feature in game.

 

Unfortunately, if you’re a RANGER, you have to have a tanker (PRS/TANK) to play in SS that is to say dual mode. 

 

Using Crystals or pets is good & more dynamic than using a tanker because you still get the AOE damage and you don’t have to always change screen that burn your eyes & make the game really annoying. It will avoid players being semi afk (that's not the aim of an MMORPG)

 

People who are lazy & still like using a PRS will be able to. But for those who don’t like dual playing, it will be a nice change. 

 

CLASS BALANCE

The staff will announce something soon, so let's see what happen. 

A lot of good suggestions has been made by players to balance chars.

 

To sum up, Some chars need to get balanced such as ASS, PRS & MS first 

This topic is just to show the current situation !

 

Thanks,

Clem.

 

What You are suggesting will ultimately be disadvantage to yourself and other players.

 

Auto mech kill fast, and brings in more EXP to you and party members..

 

Suggestion to nerf other classes will not benefit everyone. It is just mere jealousy.

 

Look at bigger picture instead of your narrow minded thinking.

 

Everyone wants faster EXP.

[ChainLancer 98]

3 minutes ago, xxxholic said:

What You are suggesting will ultimately be disadvantage to yourself and other players.

 

Auto mech kill fast, and brings in more EXP to you and party members..

 

Suggestion to nerf other classes will not benefit everyone. It is just mere jealousy.

 

Look at bigger picture instead of your narrow minded thinking.

 

Everyone wants faster EXP.

 

Sure.

 

And many Parties do not like to pt melee. 

 

Only need AUTO MS.

 

So, melee get slower exp.

 

Is fair?

[xxxholic 30]

27 minutes ago, ChainLancer said:

 

Sure.

 

And many Parties do not like to pt melee. 

 

Only need AUTO MS.

 

So, melee get slower exp.

 

Is fair?

FAKE NEWS.

 

All classes can easily get into SS parties 95% of the time.

 

Only certain spots which favors Ranger more.

 

Stop causing trouble to this game already please..... Wartale had nerfed alot of things in the past.

 

 

[ChainLancer 98]

16 minutes ago, xxxholic said:

FAKE NEWS.

 

All classes can easily get into SS parties 95% of the time.

 

Only certain spots which favors Ranger more.

 

Stop causing trouble to this game already please..... Wartale had nerfed alot of things in the past.

 

 

 

Not only some spawn for ranger.

 

Some time they only need MS auto.

 

Everyone confirm the "OP" of MS and reason why many parties want to pt Auto MS auto only.

 

 

[thisisrauldo 801]

[Lyseria 1,821]

1 hour ago, xxxholic said:

Look at bigger picture instead of your narrow minded thinking.

You should read it 50x to understand your own words.

 

If you still don't understand, read again.

[thisisrauldo 801]

1 minute ago, Lyseria said:

You should read it 50x to understand your own words.

 

If you still don't understand, read again.

 

[nameless10 208]

19 minutes ago, ChainLancer said:

 

Not only some spawn for ranger.

 

Some time they only need MS auto.

 

Everyone confirm the "OP" of MS and reason why many parties want to pt Auto MS auto only.

 

 

maybe this guy is doing service.

 

i dont know if he can understand the data above. lol 

 

its obviously OP class build.

 

 

 

Edited May 16, 2020 by nameless10

[Support 4,281]

On 5/12/2020 at 11:15 PM, Clem said:

Hello everyone,

 

Recently the forum has been very active about class balance and more precisely MS. I was the first asking to balance this class with my own playing experience but without proof. 

 

So, I did my own tests (asked by GM too) with EVERY class in game to check the difference between them.  

 

First, I would like to thanks everyone that helped me by sharing me their chars or finding one, I really appreciate it!

 

I know that the staff will announce something soon, but this is the current situation of the game (Even if it’s an average).

So it can be good to take this into consideration for your next features.

 

What’s more, is it possible to stop closing topics please?

Let’s the players give their ideas, sharing their opinion. We are the one that are playing the game.  

I’ll quote the definition of a FORUM : “a meeting or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged.”

Also, it took me ALOT of time to make the tests, suggestions.... 

Thanks in advance.

 

Besides that, I don’t make this test to NERF a class or whatever. Just to balance the game, that’s it. There’s no aim to nerf a class, or at the end people will change to other class. But BALANCING is really needed.

 

HOW DO I PROCESS?

Level used: 15x (From 149 to 155)

Items used: 138 +24 weapon & high-level items with high mix & age.

Force used: Bellum forces 

Map used: Shadow Sanctuary (144)

Party members: Solo

Tanker used : PRS with regen field (wasn’t on the party)

Moobs killed: I killed each moob of the map 4 times and more. Then I make an average of the killing time. The time is in seconds.

 

I made the test like it should be that is to say, using the BEST skill of each class, adapted of each moob.

For example, with KS I was using LS, ATA I was using Twist javelin on demon & soul sucker on moobs…. (applies this on EVERY char)

It’s the real experience from every player in game.

 

MS, AS & ATA –> I used tank since they are not able to tank.

MGS, KS, SS, FS, PS, PRS, ASS –> Tried with and without tank to show the difference.

 

 

RESULTS

 All the numbers are an average. 

I done the tests to make it the most FAIR as possible. It was the only way I had to make it.

Time is in seconds.

 

This is all the class I have tested :

 

 

Considering we all use a tanker (with PRS/MS/PETS/CRYSTALS) :

 

 

Since someone asked me, I tried with MS 149 + Tank & skill automation lvl 9. Thats is to say from 200% DMG boost to 180%. Also Atk speed from 6 to 5.

As we can see, the difference is really low and they still stay the top killer.

 

 

 

AVERAGE TIME KILLING* = The average time killing of each type of mood in SS

EXP(M)*: The exp I gain per moob in SS soloing

AVERAGE EXP PER HOUR 1VS1* = The exp the char get soloing during 1 hour in SS 

DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MS* = Difference of Exp of each class vs MS

AVERAGE % : It's the average % of the killing time of all class vs MS

 

 

ANALYSIS & FEEDBACK

from my personal experience

 

I would like to say, after trying every char that my game experience is based on how many skills I was able to use per class and how the class is tanking. (Making pets & crystals has is should be, should solve the tanking problem)

Example: 

PRS is able to use only vigor ball to kill (& extinction but only on undead), so you don’t have a dynamic while playing, it’s so repetitive. 

Whereas, 

ATA: Vengeance, Twist javelin for demon, Soul sucker, fire javelin…. 

KS have LS, grand cross & more…

PS have poison, dion’s eyes & more….
….

 

--> The staff already made it for Shaman with press deity & for mage with water tornado. It’s a pleasure to play while using some skills. This need to be implemented on more skills. 

 

Rangers VS Melee : As we can see, Rangers & Mgs are the top killers in SS. That's a good point. 

I personaly thinks that MS should stay one of the best killer with Rangers but not with a difference of 21% from Mage. It should be close to others Rangers.

 

MS (auto) : You are able to be the best killer in SS using the cheapest gears of the game.

It’s a class where you have nothing to do, just being semi afk… I must say a boring class. 

You still have more exp than a 16x KS for example.

But it's nice class for those people who want to be able to play without spending a lot of coins in game.

It shouldn't be the best killer in Wartale since is suppose to be a tanker. Maybe a good killer but not the best.  

 

MGS : It’s a nice class where you’re able to use different skills. 

I would love to see death ray back, but it’s because of nostalgia ?

 

AS : You have to use a Tanker to play in SS that is to say to play in dual mode (that I don’t like) since pets die easy & the system is bad there. 

But it’s a good killer in SS, as it should be.

 

ATA : I like to play this class since she has many skills to use, it's a dynamic class.

 

KS : It’s my own class ATM. The best melee class in SS from my tests. The T5 skill LS has nice DMG. 

 

SS : Well, it’s a good class but I never really liked SS (it’s personal). He have good tank abilities. To sum up, it was good to play with this class in Shadow Sanctuary. 

 

FS & PS : Kinda hard to tank sometime, I used to die. Hope their T5 skills will improve them (like KS with LS).

 

ASS : I had the worst experience in game with this char. You deal low DMG and are not able to tank. This class really need something to be done… I saw many nice suggestions about it.

 

PRS : You have to use holy mind on some moobs. It’s a boring class too since it’s repetitive and it take some time to kill a moob (compare to other class)

 

 

PETS & CRYSTALS

I still don’t understand why nothing is made to make this like it SHOULD BE. Everyone agree that is was a useful feature in game.

 

Unfortunately, if you’re a RANGER, you have to have a tanker (PRS/TANK) to play in SS that is to say dual mode. 

 

Using Crystals or pets is good & more dynamic than using a tanker because you still get the AOE damage and you don’t have to always change screen that burn your eyes & make the game really annoying. It will avoid players being semi afk (that's not the aim of an MMORPG)

 

People who are lazy & still like using a PRS will be able to. But for those who don’t like dual playing, it will be a nice change. 

 

CLASS BALANCE

The staff will announce something soon, so let's see what happen. 

A lot of good suggestions has been made by players to balance chars.

 

To sum up, Some chars need to get balanced such as ASS, PRS & MS first 

This topic is just to show the current situation !

 

Thanks,

Clem.

 

 

Excellent, we will need help from everyone like you very soon :).

[Palhacitos 480]

9 hours ago, xxxholic said:

What You are suggesting will ultimately be disadvantage to yourself and other players.

 

Auto mech kill fast, and brings in more EXP to you and party members..

 

Suggestion to nerf other classes will not benefit everyone. It is just mere jealousy.

 

Look at bigger picture instead of your narrow minded thinking.

 

Everyone wants faster EXP.

 

8 hours ago, xxxholic said:

FAKE NEWS.

 

All classes can easily get into SS parties 95% of the time.

 

Only certain spots which favors Ranger more.

 

Stop causing trouble to this game already please..... Wartale had nerfed alot of things in the past.

 

 

Please do not use a font of this size. 

 

If possible use the default font and size.

 

 

[ChainOfPain 114]

IMO , they should balance by buffing the other classes (IN PVE) not nerfing any , i dont mind the MS being a strong char with few items if others are just as strong and as mentioned above changed to be more dynamic ^^