CLASS TESTS IN SS

[Clem 1,241]

Hello everyone,

 

Recently the forum has been very active about class balance and more precisely MS. I was the first asking to balance this class with my own playing experience but without proof. 

 

So, I did my own tests (asked by GM too) with EVERY class in game to check the difference between them.  

 

First, I would like to thanks everyone that helped me by sharing me their chars or finding one, I really appreciate it!

 

I know that the staff will announce something soon, but this is the current situation of the game (Even if it’s an average).

So it can be good to take this into consideration for your next features.

 

What’s more, is it possible to stop closing topics please?

Let’s the players give their ideas, sharing their opinion. We are the one that are playing the game.  

I’ll quote the definition of a FORUM : “a meeting or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged.”

Also, it took me ALOT of time to make the tests, suggestions.... 

Thanks in advance.

 

Besides that, I don’t make this test to NERF a class or whatever. Just to balance the game, that’s it. There’s no aim to nerf a class, or at the end people will change to other class. But BALANCING is really needed.

 

HOW DO I PROCESS?

Level used: 15x (From 149 to 155)

Items used: 138 +24 weapon & high-level items with high mix & age.

Force used: Bellum forces 

Map used: Shadow Sanctuary (144)

Party members: Solo

Tanker used : PRS with regen field (wasn’t on the party)

Moobs killed: I killed each moob of the map 4 times and more. Then I make an average of the killing time. The time is in seconds.

 

I made the test like it should be that is to say, using the BEST skill of each class, adapted of each moob.

For example, with KS I was using LS, ATA I was using Twist javelin on demon & soul sucker on moobs…. (applies this on EVERY char)

It’s the real experience from every player in game.

 

MS, AS & ATA –> I used tank since they are not able to tank.

MGS, KS, SS, FS, PS, PRS, ASS –> Tried with and without tank to show the difference.

 

 

RESULTS

 All the numbers are an average. 

I done the tests to make it the most FAIR as possible. It was the only way I had to make it.

Time is in seconds.

 

This is all the class I have tested :

 

 

Considering we all use a tanker (with PRS/MS/PETS/CRYSTALS) :

 

 

Since someone asked me, I tried with MS 149 + Tank & skill automation lvl 9. Thats is to say from 200% DMG boost to 180%. Also Atk speed from 6 to 5.

As we can see, the difference is really low and they still stay the top killer.

 

 

 

AVERAGE TIME KILLING* = The average time killing of each type of mood in SS

EXP(M)*: The exp I gain per moob in SS soloing

AVERAGE EXP PER HOUR 1VS1* = The exp the char get soloing during 1 hour in SS 

DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MS* = Difference of Exp of each class vs MS

AVERAGE % : It's the average % of the killing time of all class vs MS

 

 

ANALYSIS & FEEDBACK

from my personal experience

 

I would like to say, after trying every char that my game experience is based on how many skills I was able to use per class and how the class is tanking. (Making pets & crystals has is should be, should solve the tanking problem)

Example: 

PRS is able to use only vigor ball to kill (& extinction but only on undead), so you don’t have a dynamic while playing, it’s so repetitive. 

Whereas, 

ATA: Vengeance, Twist javelin for demon, Soul sucker, fire javelin…. 

KS have LS, grand cross & more…

PS have poison, dion’s eyes & more….
….

 

--> The staff already made it for Shaman with press deity & for mage with water tornado. It’s a pleasure to play while using some skills. This need to be implemented on more skills. 

 

Rangers VS Melee : As we can see, Rangers & Mgs are the top killers in SS. That's a good point. 

I personaly thinks that MS should stay one of the best killer with Rangers but not with a difference of 21% from Mage. It should be close to others Rangers.

 

MS (auto) : You are able to be the best killer in SS using the cheapest gears of the game.

It’s a class where you have nothing to do, just being semi afk… I must say a boring class. 

You still have more exp than a 16x KS for example.

But it's nice class for those people who want to be able to play without spending a lot of coins in game.

It shouldn't be the best killer in Wartale since is suppose to be a tanker. Maybe a good killer but not the best.  

 

MGS : It’s a nice class where you’re able to use different skills. 

I would love to see death ray back, but it’s because of nostalgia ?

 

AS : You have to use a Tanker to play in SS that is to say to play in dual mode (that I don’t like) since pets die easy & the system is bad there. 

But it’s a good killer in SS, as it should be.

 

ATA : I like to play this class since she has many skills to use, it's a dynamic class.

 

KS : It’s my own class ATM. The best melee class in SS from my tests. The T5 skill LS has nice DMG. 

 

SS : Well, it’s a good class but I never really liked SS (it’s personal). He have good tank abilities. To sum up, it was good to play with this class in Shadow Sanctuary. 

 

FS & PS : Kinda hard to tank sometime, I used to die. Hope their T5 skills will improve them (like KS with LS).

 

ASS : I had the worst experience in game with this char. You deal low DMG and are not able to tank. This class really need something to be done… I saw many nice suggestions about it.

 

PRS : You have to use holy mind on some moobs. It’s a boring class too since it’s repetitive and it take some time to kill a moob (compare to other class)

 

 

PETS & CRYSTALS

I still don’t understand why nothing is made to make this like it SHOULD BE. Everyone agree that is was a useful feature in game.

 

Unfortunately, if you’re a RANGER, you have to have a tanker (PRS/TANK) to play in SS that is to say dual mode. 

 

Using Crystals or pets is good & more dynamic than using a tanker because you still get the AOE damage and you don’t have to always change screen that burn your eyes & make the game really annoying. It will avoid players being semi afk (that's not the aim of an MMORPG)

 

People who are lazy & still like using a PRS will be able to. But for those who don’t like dual playing, it will be a nice change. 

 

CLASS BALANCE

The staff will announce something soon, so let's see what happen. 

A lot of good suggestions has been made by players to balance chars.

 

To sum up, Some chars need to get balanced such as ASS, PRS & MS first 

This topic is just to show the current situation !

 

Thanks,

Clem.

 

Edited May 16, 2020 by Clem

[thisisrauldo 801]

/ban /deletepost JAJAJAJAJAJ good job Clemzinho ♥ 

[Mjizzy_7 1,899]

8 minutes ago, Clem said:

Hello everyone,

 

Recently the forum has been very active about class balance and more precisely MS. I was the first asking to balance this class with my own playing experience but without proof. 

 

So, I did my own tests (asked by GM too) with EVERY class in game to check the difference between them.  

 

First, I would like to thanks everyone that helped me by sharing me their chars or finding one, I really appreciate it!

 

I know that the staff will announce something soon, but this is the current situation of the game (Even if it’s an average).

So it can be good to take this into consideration for your next features.

 

What’s more, is it possible to stop closing topics please?

Let’s the players give their ideas, sharing their opinion. We are the one that are playing the game.  

I’ll quote the definition of a FORUM : “a meeting or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged.”

Also, it takes time to make tests, suggestions.... 

Thanks in advance.

 

Besides that, I don’t make this test to NERF a class or whatever. Just to balance the game, that’s it. There’s no aim to nerf a class, or at the end people will change to other class. But BALANCING is really needed.

 

HOW DO I PROCESS?

Level used: 15x (From 149 to 155)

Items used: 138 +24 weapon & high-level items with high mix & age.

Force used: Bellum forces 

Map used: Shadow Sanctuary (144)

Party members: Solo

Tanker used : PRS with regen shield (wasn’t on the party)

Moobs killed: I killed each moob of the map 4 times and more. Then I make an average of the killing time. The time is in seconds.

 

I made the test like it should be that is to say, using the BEST skill of each class, adapted of each moob.

For example, with KS I was using LS, ATA I was using Twist javelin on demon & soul sucker on moobs…. (applies this on EVERY char)

It’s the real experience from every player in game.

 

MS, AS & ATA –> I used tank since they are not able to tank.

MGS, KS, SS, FS, PS, PRS, ASS –> Tried with and without tank to show the difference.

 

 

RESULTS

 All the numbers are an average. 

I done the tests to make it the most FAIR as possible. It was the only way I had to make it.

 

Time is in seconds.

This is all the class I have tested :

 

 

Considering we all use a tanker (with PRS/MS/PETS/CRYSTALS) :

 

 

 

AVERAGE TIME KILLING* = The average time killing of each type of mood in SS

EXP(M)*: The exp I gain per moob in SS soloing

AVERAGE EXP PER HOUR 1VS1* = The exp the char get soloing during 1 hour in SS 

DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MS* = Difference of Exp of each class vs MS

AVERAGE % : It's the average % of the killing time of all class vs MS

 

 

ANALYSIS & FEEDBACK

from my personal experience

 

I would like to say, after trying every char that my game experience is based on how many skills I was able to use per class and how the class is tanking. (Making pets & crystals has is should be, should solve the tanking problem)

Example: 

PRS is able to use only vigor ball to kill (& extinction but only on undead), so you don’t have a dynamic while playing, it’s so repetitive. 

Whereas, 

ATA: Vengeance, Twist javelin for demon, Soul sucker, fire javelin…. 

KS have LS, grand cross & more…

PS have poison, dion’s eyes & more….
….

 

--> The staff already made it for Shaman with press deity & for mage with water tornado. It’s a pleasure to play while using some skills. This need to be implemented on more skills. 

 

MS (auto) : You are able to be the best killer in SS using the cheapest gears of the game.

It’s a class where you have nothing to do, just being semi afk… I must say a boring class. 

You still have more exp than a 16x KS for example.

But it's nice class for those people who want to be able to play without spending a lot of coins in game.

It shouldn't be the best killer in Wartale since is suppose to be a tanker. Maybe a good killer but not the best.  

 

MGS : It’s a nice class where you’re able to use different skills. 

I would love to see death ray back, but it’s because of nostalgia ?

 

AS : You have to use a Tanker to play in SS that is to say to play in dual mode (that I don’t like) since pets die easy & the system is bad there. 

But it’s a good killer in SS, as it should be.

 

ATA : I like to play this class since she has many skills to use, it's a dynamic class.

 

KS : It’s my own class ATM. The best melee class in SS from my tests. The T5 skill LS has nice DMG. 

 

SS : Well, it’s a good class but I never really liked SS (it’s personal). To sum up, it was good to play with this class in Shadow Sanctuary. 

 

FS & PS : Kinda hard to tank sometime, I used to die. Hope their T5 skills will improve them (like KS with LS).

 

ASS : I had the worst experience in game with this char. You deal low DMG and are not able to tank. This class really need something to be done… I saw many nice suggestions about it.

 

PRS : You have to use holy mind on some moobs. It’s a boring class too since it’s repetitive and it take some time to kill a moob (compare to other class)

 

 

PETS & CRYSTALS

I still don’t understand why nothing is made to make this like it SHOULD BE. Everyone agree that is was a useful feature in game.

 

Unfortunately, if you’re a RANGER, you have to have a tanker (PRS/TANK) to play in SS that is to say dual mode. 

 

Using Crystals or pets is good & more dynamic than using a tanker because you still get the AOE damage and you don’t have to always change screen that burn your eyes & make the game really annoying. It will avoid players being semi afk (that's not the aim of an MMORPG)

 

People who are lazy & still like using a PRS will be able to. But for those who don’t like dual playing, it will be a nice change. 

 

Thanks,

Clem.

 

Amazing post bro?

[Palhacitos 480]

?

just one word to define this work: incredible

[HoOoOoDLUM 112]

16 minutes ago, Clem said:

Hello everyone,

 

Recently the forum has been very active about class balance and more precisely MS. I was the first asking to balance this class with my own playing experience but without proof. 

 

So, I did my own tests (asked by GM too) with EVERY class in game to check the difference between them.  

 

First, I would like to thanks everyone that helped me by sharing me their chars or finding one, I really appreciate it!

 

I know that the staff will announce something soon, but this is the current situation of the game (Even if it’s an average).

So it can be good to take this into consideration for your next features.

 

What’s more, is it possible to stop closing topics please?

Let’s the players give their ideas, sharing their opinion. We are the one that are playing the game.  

I’ll quote the definition of a FORUM : “a meeting or medium where ideas and views on a particular issue can be exchanged.”

Also, it takes time to make tests, suggestions.... 

Thanks in advance.

 

Besides that, I don’t make this test to NERF a class or whatever. Just to balance the game, that’s it. There’s no aim to nerf a class, or at the end people will change to other class. But BALANCING is really needed.

 

HOW DO I PROCESS?

 

Level used: 15x (From 149 to 155)

Items used: 138 +24 weapon & high-level items with high mix & age.

Force used: Bellum forces 

Map used: Shadow Sanctuary (144)

Party members: Solo

Tanker used : PRS with regen shield (wasn’t on the party)

Moobs killed: I killed each moob of the map 4 times and more. Then I make an average of the killing time. The time is in seconds.

 

I made the test like it should be that is to say, using the BEST skill of each class, adapted of each moob.

For example, with KS I was using LS, ATA I was using Twist javelin on demon & soul sucker on moobs…. (applies this on EVERY char)

It’s the real experience from every player in game.

 

MS, AS & ATA –> I used tank since they are not able to tank.

MGS, KS, SS, FS, PS, PRS, ASS –> Tried with and without tank to show the difference.

 

 

RESULTS

 All the numbers are an average. 

I done the tests to make it the most FAIR as possible. It was the only way I had to make it.

 

Time is in seconds.

This is all the class I have tested :

 

 

Considering we all use a tanker (with PRS/MS/PETS/CRYSTALS) :

 

 

 

AVERAGE TIME KILLING* = The average time killing of each type of mood in SS

EXP(M)*: The exp I gain per moob in SS soloing

AVERAGE EXP PER HOUR 1VS1* = The exp the char get soloing during 1 hour in SS 

DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MS* = Difference of Exp of each class vs MS

 

 

ANALYSIS & FEEDBACK

from my personal experience

 

I would like to say, after trying every char that my game experience is based on how many skills I was able to use per class and how the class is tanking. (Making pets & crystals has is should be, should solve the tanking problem)

Example: 

PRS is able to use only vigor ball to kill (& extinction but only on undead), so you don’t have a dynamic while playing, it’s so repetitive. 

Whereas, 

ATA: Vengeance, Twist javelin for demon, Soul sucker, fire javelin…. 

KS have LS, grand cross & more…

PS have poison, dion’s eyes & more….
….

 

--> The staff already made it for Shaman with press deity & for mage with water tornado. It’s a pleasure to play while using some skills. This need to be implemented on more skills. 

 

MS (auto) : You are able to be the best killer in SS using the cheapest gears of the game.

It’s a class where you have nothing to do, just being semi afk… I must say a boring class. 

You still have more exp than a 16x KS for example.

But it's nice class for those people who want to be able to play without spending a lot of coins in game.

It shouldn't be the best killer in Wartale since is suppose to be a tanker. Maybe a good killer but not the best.  

 

MGS : It’s a nice class where you’re able to use different skills. 

I would love to see death ray back, but it’s because of nostalgia ?

 

AS : You have to use a Tanker to play in SS that is to say to play in dual mode (that I don’t like) since pets die easy & the system is bad there. 

But it’s a good killer in SS, as it should be.

 

ATA : I like to play this class since she has many skills to use, it's a dynamic class.

 

KS : It’s my own class ATM. The best melee class in SS from my tests. The T5 skill LS has nice DMG. 

 

SS : Well, it’s a good class but I never really liked SS (it’s personal). To sum up, it was good to play with this class in Shadow Sanctuary. 

 

FS & PS : Kinda hard to tank sometime, I used to die. Hope their T5 skills will improve them (like KS with LS).

 

ASS : I had the worst experience in game with this char. You deal low DMG and are not able to tank. This class really need something to be done… I saw many nice suggestions about it.

 

PRS : You have to use holy mind on some moobs. It’s a boring class too since it’s repetitive and it take some time to kill a moob (compare to other class)

 

 

PETS & CRYSTALS

I still don’t understand why nothing is made to make this like it SHOULD BE. Everyone agree that is was a useful feature in game.

 

Unfortunately, if you’re a RANGER, you have to have a tanker (PRS/TANK) to play in SS that is to say dual mode. 

 

Using Crystals or pets is good & more dynamic than using a tanker because you still get the AOE damage and you don’t have to always change screen that burn your eyes & make the game really annoying. It will avoid players being semi afk (that's not the aim of an MMORPG)

 

People who are lazy & still like using a PRS will be able to. But for those who don’t like dual playing, it will be a nice change. 

 

Thanks,

Clem.

 

Super proud of you bro , amazing work really and the amount of details show how realistic results we have in game really , really hope people would look at this with an open mind and atleast appreciate the hard work u have put to do something like this ♥

[- D E A T H S T R O K E - 1,760]

Congratulations for the nice post, it was indeed a hard work.

My opinion:

You did those tests with 138+24 items right? which means that mage with staff 142+24 will be even more powerful than that , so it means that mage with an AoE skill can do close to mechs 1x1 damage with high end items and he doesn't need tanker.

I did a video test a while ago comparing my mage 13x Aoe damage vs shaman 155 and Priest 153 :

 

Mage 130 [ ~45 sec to kill xetan]

 

Shaman 155 [ ~45 sec to kill xetan]

 

Priest 153 [ ~1:27 sec to kill xetan]

 

 

I'm not saying this to nerf mage, but, as a proof that the problem might be the other classes are too weak on PVE.

 

Edited May 12, 2020 by - D E A T H S T R O K E -

[-Enigma- 190]

congratulations clem! very product topic AND WITH NUMBERS! for whiners.

 

 

now, talking a little about the numbers ... kkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk

seriously, I won't even comment on the first table (only ranger with tanker), so as not to get too ugly for auto mech defenders..

 

LOOK AT THE DIFFERENCE OF MS 149 WITH THE PIKE (152) AND FIGHTER(153).. BOTH WITH TANKER TOO !!

 

@Wartale @Senpai ,support asked for so much evidence with numbers and tests ... now we have the evidence here ... I believe it was very clear!

 

hugs

 

 

[Lev 323]

Nice job Clem.
 

[Palhacitos 480]

Sorry I didn't want to do this with your incredible work but I think this will make it easier.

 

?

[alexsanderDN 1]

Good job Clem ♡

[Neolitix 3]

Good job bro 

I didn’t see you in home for two days .

Hopping that’s your « work » will be rewarded.

 

[TerroR 4]

Good Work, Bro!!

MS Auto no need Nerf, but all others class need buff to PvE

[-[Grin][Department]- 115]

Wow, great output!

[suesue 234]

Awesome Clem. Now we should talk about a number. haha

[EternalLighting 26]

Nice work, but you left out what your ideas are for change, like for example... some people had said to reduce Automation from 200% to 150% and I think is too much, maybe 175% or 165% on level 10 and compensate the nerf on defense, just to see how it'll go from there.

 

And not trying to be disrespectful here, but GM already made the tests (although you did a great job there) but I believe the time for tests are over, now its time to put some ideas on the table.

[Clem 1,241]

3 minutes ago, EternalLighting said:

Nice work, but you left out what your ideas are for change, like for example... some people had said to reduce Automation from 200% to 150% and I think is too much, maybe 175% or 165% on level 10 and compensate the nerf on defense, just to see how it'll go from there.

Right, that’s also why I made the test.
 

5 minutes ago, EternalLighting said:

And not trying to be disrespectful here, but GM already made the tests (although you did a great job there) but I believe the time for tests are over, now its time to put some ideas on the table.

 

They don’t made it using 15x chars (average level of players there)  on a 144 map. 
They made some test with 169 chars that does not represent the reality. 
Also, they tried fews chars. And we don’t have any numbers on their tests & how they have done it.

Also, it’s a free test for them & players (maybe in additional to their test), so it’s not an useless work. But thanks for your message.

According to the ideas : People have made a lot of nice suggestions on the suggestions board, I recommend you to go there ?

[Palhacitos 480]

2 hours ago, Clem said:

This is all the class I have tested :

 

If we look at the chart "Average Exp per hour 1vs1"
let's see that the rangers classes managed between 214 to 232
and the melee classes managed between 180 to 204

already PRS and ASS we saw that they were between 149 to 163 (need to be improved)

 

About MS it was clear that it needs to be changed to the point that it is between 214 to 232.

____________________________________

maybe changing this skill is the solution.

 

140%? 160%? 180%?
@Clem 

I know I'm asking a lot but could I test this skill in Levels 7, 8 and 9?

so we will know the limit that needs to be applied, to leave the MS between 214 to 232 "Average Exp per hour 1vs1".

Edited May 12, 2020 by Palhacitos

[EternalLighting 26]

5 minutes ago, Clem said:

According to the ideas : People have made a lot of nice suggestions on the suggestions board, I recommend you to go there ?

 

Right, and I suggest we do something like this so we can discuss.

7 minutes ago, Clem said:

so it’s not an useless work. But thanks for your message.

 

I didn't said it was useless.

[Hurricane 68]

Really nice job, a real test with real chars.

[nameless10 208]

2 hours ago, HoOoOoDLUM said:

Super proud of you bro , amazing work really and the amount of details show how realistic results we have in game really , really hope people would look at this with an open mind and atleast appreciate the hard work u have put to do something like this ♥

probably the fs there is using axe bro jaja

 

 

amazing job bro. 

 

hope the AutoMs fanatics realized the data lol

Edited May 12, 2020 by nameless10

[Destination 29]

Amazing work for the this.

But to compare melee with tank and ranger with tank is total diff( melee still got big hit from mob)

i think ranger+tank compare melee+ 2 prs for healing. That should be the way to compare.

according to the chart: Mgs is  OP with his ability to kill and ability to tank.

Look the damage l auto ms is the best nothing to say about it.

But look the survival chance if some how the tanker die. The chance for ms auto to survive  is the lowest  one.

 

[Clem 1,241]

9 minutes ago, Destination said:

Amazing work for the this.

But to compare melee with tank and ranger with tank is total diff( melee still got big hit from mob)

i think ranger+tank compare melee+ 2 prs for healing. That should be the way to compare.

according to the chart: Mgs is  OP with his ability to kill and ability to tank.

Look the damage l auto ms is the best nothing to say about it.

But look the survival chance if some how the tanker die. The chance for ms auto to survive  is the lowest  one.

 

Sorry but not everyone has 2 prs to heal their chars and it’s nonsense at all to play a game like that. 
Beside that, you must read carefully my topic because as said before, it’s based on the reality of the game play. 

Edited May 12, 2020 by Clem

[Destination 29]

Most i see is prs healing a melee  class not really for a tanker . u  are not agree with that?

[Smilo 109]

good job and for sure much work. Would be cool to see archer more up and pets more useful like u already suggested. Prs, ASs and lower need to be improved for sure.. And ms still too high.

[Clem 1,241]

3 hours ago, Palhacitos said:

If we look at the chart "Average Exp per hour 1vs1"
let's see that the rangers classes managed between 214 to 232
and the melee classes managed between 180 to 204

already PRS and ASS we saw that they were between 149 to 163 (need to be improved)

 

About MS it was clear that it needs to be changed to the point that it is between 214 to 232.

____________________________________

maybe changing this skill is the solution.

 

140%? 160%? 180%?
@Clem 

I know I'm asking a lot but could I test this skill in Levels 7, 8 and 9?

so we will know the limit that needs to be applied, to leave the MS between 214 to 232 "Average Exp per hour 1vs1".

Done, I edited topic !