Why be a ranger today?

[Merenda 693]

Hi! First of all, I would like to explain that I am no longer a Ranger, but anyway, I am sensitive to the situation of these two classes in particular.

 

Yes, I know that we have a lot of "ranger haters" on the server, either because of an ego conflict where they feel offended by dying for a female character, or maybe because they really do not perform well in PvP against these two classes.

 

Unfortunately this happens, but even though I am sure that some will come to give free rage simply because it is about Rangers, I cannot remain silent about what has been happening. That said, let's get to the point.
 

Would you be Ranger today? No? Why? Here is my experience with the class on the server...

 

I love doing two things here, Siege War and Exp. I look for and study every single detail, mainly about Siege War, so that each day I try to improve more. In the "Priston structure" we all know the semi-meta that occurs during Siege War... Rangers have always been HRHR (High Risk, High Reward) characters. But unfortunately the "High Reward" part doesn't happen. The situation of the Rangers today is that, characters with armor and shield dealing much more damage than an pure Archer or Ata, being that these two pure classes die in practically 1 hit for any character up to 15 levels below.

 

Today, playing Ranger is frustrating, even if you love the class. I gave up on Ranger for the moment because I have a relatively good level and items, but still deals less damage than almost all classes, and was by far the most fragile class in the game. I am now in a class considered easier and more basic to play, but at least I perform much better in Siege War.

 

Archer and Ata today are literally a joke. After the constant and heavy nerfs that both classes received, I wouldn't be scared if an Archer or Ata 170 failed to beat a Mech or Knight 153. It is not a nerf request for other classes, it makes no sense to nerf all other classes until they get weak like Archer and Ata; It is a request to find a way to put these classes in their proper positions. If we check the Ranking... Atas don't even need to comment, and Archers, only two of them play PvP actively.

 

Now on to the reasons for not being a Ranger today:

 

1- Exp? We have better Exp classes. (and that's fair, not a complaint);

 

2- PvP? You can be a Knight / Mech, do a lot more damage than any ranger, and still be one of the most tanker classes in the game; You can be a Pike / Fighter / Assassin, and have the ability to nullify a target effectively and quickly;

 

3- Siege War? You can be a Mage and literally destroy any class at the event; Or a Pris, and score very well while giving great support to your Clan; Or even a Shaman which is good for both PvP and Siege War.

 

None of these points mentioned above is wrong! This is the fun part of the game, each class having its peculiarities and functions! But where are the Archers and Atas? They don't fit into anything there, because they are inferior to all other classes at all points in the game.

 

 

This is a topic asking for minimal attention to the server's Rangers, but I will also leave a "global suggestion" for the case:

 

-> Transform Rangers back into High Risk High Reward classes. If a Ranger is pure build and dies in 1 hit for anyone, it must have the highest damage in the game to make up for it.

 

Thanks in advance, and Avante Wartale! =^---^=

Edited July 28, 2020 by Merenda

[Palhacitos 480]

Hi, I agree with many points indicated.
 

7 minutes ago, Merenda said:

Now on to the reasons for not being a Ranger today

I would not become AS for the obvious reasons:
Cannot level solo (tank required)
It is an easy target in BC, and has other classes with more impact.

 

I would like the team to work better on the ranger classes, making it more viable for use

[Sananda 567]

 

I can only comment on my experience in PVP because I don't usually go to PVE.

 

The biggest advantage of being a Ranger consists of high range, speed and rate (that's a fact).

 

With the mounts running in BC all that advantage was basically destroyed.

With the new general nerf in PVP, some classes (which depend on damage) are suffering more than others (as Archer)

Therefore, I would ask Staff that any change in the PVP should not be done unilaterally, but thinking about the possible balance of the 10 classes in the game.

(This came very close with the zeus project)

 

@With regard to atalanta in PVP I believe that the SPLIT needs to be adjusted.

 

@Regarding PVP, in general, I would ask Staff to bring back some AoE skills in PVP (from all classes, with an average damage between classes). This allows a greater possibility of skills in both 1x1 and SW, as well as new strategies in PVP.

 

 

Edited July 28, 2020 by Sananda

[Merenda 693]

1 hour ago, Palhacitos said:

Hi, I agree with many points indicated.
 

I would not become AS for the obvious reasons:
Cannot level solo (tank required)
It is an easy target in BC, and has other classes with more impact.

 

I would like the team to work better on the ranger classes, making it more viable for use

 

Agreed, unfortunately Rangers are currently the easiest classes to cancel, and the least impactful classes in PvP, especially in terms of Siege War scores x.x'

 

 

1 hour ago, Sananda said:

 

I can only comment on my experience in PVP because I don't usually go to PVE.

 

The biggest advantage of being a Ranger consists of high range, speed and rate (that's a fact).

 

With the mounts running in BC all that advantage was basically destroyed.

With the new general nerf in PVP, some classes (which depend on damage) are suffering more than others (as Archer)

Therefore, I would ask Staff that any change in the PVP should not be done unilaterally, but thinking about the possible balance of the 10 classes in the game.

(This came very close with the zeus project)

 

@With regard to atalanta in PVP I believe that the SPLIT needs to be adjusted.

 

@Regarding PVP, in general, I would ask Staff to bring back some AoE skills in PVP (from all classes, with an average damage between classes). This allows a greater possibility of skills in both 1x1 and SW, as well as new strategies in PVP.

 

 

 

The only positive point of Rangers was the ability to score well in Siege War, given the heavy nerfs they have been taking in recent months, especially with the arrival of the mounts. And now they went to "Hero to Zero", for simply removing their AoE skills, the only positive point of these classes.

 

PS: Based on the print they used, an Archer making 700 kills being 100% pure build (dying for literally 1 hit by anyone) is something much weaker than what we face now in Siege War.

Edited July 28, 2020 by Merenda

[HollyShot 968]

Yes archer and atalanta is in a bad situation right now after the last dmg nerf.

imo atalanta would be great again if staff simple back Split to what it was before (i hope they have a "backup"). But since i dont really play this class i wish players that have experience in atalanta give their opinion (although I know that most of the top level atalantas have already changed class).

Well archer i do have test many times since it's my main class for years. I can't add much more to the topic since Merenda has already described the problem very well but I will specify some examples of builds that I tested to demonstrate how the class is at a big disadvantage and unbalanced. I'm talking about pvp.

If we play using armor like male classes, we can tank really well but our critical damage in ph would be 1,3k~1,4k while the other classes (FS/PS/MS/ASS/SS/KS) would reach 2k+ damage. So yes, we can tank for a time but it is inevitable that when the critic comes we will die in a hit kill. We have to count on luck to hit two sequential critical hits to kill someone solo, which is very unlikely in wartale.

Now if we change for cuepy and base health we can reach 2k damage, but our hp with VL would be around 1,2k, defense 3k, abs ~166. It was a really hard build to play even before the last nerfs since we always have invisible PS/ASS waiting to neutralize archers, but now that all classes have speed (with mounts) this build has become practically useless, archers using it are killed instantly when go inside pvp.

The least worst build for pvp at the moment is cuepy with some points in health. Using this build archer can hit 1,5~1,7k and reach 2k hp. But it's not fair imo we have to sacrifice most of our defense/abs to not even reach a male damage who has practially all the advantages + hp, + defense,  +abs, + damage.

About the new skill Solar Arrow, i really liked it and we do have a better damage but since it's not enough to hit kill males and we need 2 sequential hits to kill, it's better if we only use phoenix shot that is faster. So it's helping during pvp when we have situations of 2x1+ but it's not enough to balance archers.

Archers for Siege War were destroyed after so much nerfs (especially after perforation became useless). It is the most focused class for being the most vulnerable and has no compensation for that. AS 16x can reach 1 hit rate for clan while a mage 15x can reach 7 hit rate.

That is my feedback in how bad and unbalance archers are now, and my suggestion to staff is bring back our damage in phoenix shot for normal pvp and increase the damage in perforation to make archers useful for sw. Thanks.

 

[Merenda 693]

25 minutes ago, HollyShot said:

Yes archer and atalanta is in a bad situation right now after the last dmg nerf.

imo atalanta would be great again if staff simple back Split to what it was before (i hope they have a "backup"). But since i dont really play this class i wish players that have experience in atalanta give their opinion (although I know that most of the top level atalantas have already changed class).

Well archer i do have test many times since it's my main class for years. I can't add much more to the topic since Merenda has already described the problem very well but I will specify some examples of builds that I tested to demonstrate how the class is at a big disadvantage and unbalanced. I'm talking about pvp.

If we play using armor like male classes, we can tank really well but our critical damage in ph would be 1,3k~1,4k while the other classes (FS/PS/MS/ASS/SS/KS) would reach 2k+ damage. So yes, we can tank for a time but it is inevitable that when the critic comes we will die in a hit kill. We have to count on luck to hit two sequential critical hits to kill someone solo, which is very unlikely in wartale.

Now if we change for cuepy and base health we can reach 2k damage, but our hp with VL would be around 1,2k, defense 3k, abs ~166. It was a really hard build to play even before the last nerfs since we always have invisible PS/ASS waiting to neutralize archers, but now that all classes have speed (with mounts) this build has become practically useless, archers using it are killed instantly when go inside pvp.

The least worst build for pvp at the moment is cuepy with some points in health. Using this build archer can hit 1,5~1,7k and reach 2k hp. But it's not fair imo we have to sacrifice most of our defense/abs to not even reach a male damage who has practially all the advantages + hp, + defense,  +abs, + damage.

About the new skill Solar Arrow, i really liked it and we do have a better damage but since it's not enough to hit kill males and we need 2 sequential hits to kill, it's better if we only use phoenix shot that is faster. So it's helping during pvp when we have situations of 2x1+ but it's not enough to balance archers.

Archers for Siege War were destroyed after so much nerfs (especially after perforation became useless). It is the most focused class for being the most vulnerable and has no compensation for that. AS 16x can reach 1 hit rate for clan while a mage 15x can reach 7 hit rate.

That is my feedback in how bad and unbalance archers are now, and my suggestion to staff is bring back our damage in phoenix shot for normal pvp and increase the damage in perforation to make archers useful for sw. Thanks.

 

 

As for Siege War, it is almost unbelievable that an Archer 16x score 7 ~ 10x less than a Mage 148. Unfortunately, the reality of the class today is this.

 

No matter what the build is, Archer will do less damage and be much more fragile than any other character.

 

It doesn't make sense for an Archer with Cuepy + Health (current meta build) doing less damage than a meele, since she is thousands of times more fragile.

Edited July 28, 2020 by Merenda

[DarkLink64 921]

3 hours ago, Merenda said:

As for Siege War, it is almost unbelievable that an Archer 16x score 7 ~ 10x less than a Mage 148. Unfortunately, the reality of the class today is this.

It is not unbelievable, it is quite easy to understand.

Magicians are broken on Siege War right now, on the same way Archer was before. However there is a little difference between Magicians and Archers: Magicians can tank more and has Distortion.

Why Magicians are broken? The very same reason Archers were: AoE damage.

Magicians Diastrophism and Fireball are AoE skills that still deals 100% damage on PvP. Not only Magician, but Shaman still has a skill named Spiritual Flare that also does 100% damage on PvP.

Solution is simple: Halve all those skills, the same way everyone else got their AoE halved.

Also, it is clear that one of the root problems of Siege War is AoE damage. That's why I've suggested a different modifier for 1v1 and AoE, and it got into the game. 

Now we just need to wait the Staff to reduce even further the AoE damage in Siege War. If it's currently 0.18, then it should went down to 0.09.


Now you've changed into KS because you can't play without a broken skill (Old Perforation). But hey! Knights doesnt have any AoE Broken Skill that critically strike from afar and deals 100% damage.  I have no doubt that soon you'll make a thread talking about how weak Knights are, and then, realize that regardless the class you play, you suck.

You thought you were good because of a broken skill (Old Archer Perforation), it got fixed, then you went downhill. You should have changed to Magician to enjoy it's last breath of being an broken class, i'm sure it will be balanced soon.

Looking forward to your Fix Knight Please =^--^=

Edited July 28, 2020 by DarkLink64

[Merenda 693]

I don't think nerf after nerf is the solution. If Mage gets any nerfs, the class will be useless, since the class's only strength is Siege War. It doesn't make sense to nerfy a class that only does one thing in the entire game.

 

Let's go to an example of an OP class? I recently went back to the class I started on the server, Knight

 

-> I have an extremely solid PvP, I hardly die, with a shield the chances are almost zero;

 

-> Greater group control of the entire game.

 

-> And here's the most impressive. At Exp, as opposite any thought, Knight does very well! I kill a little less than an AutoMS, without sacrificing build points. LS + Watornado is the most OP thing I've ever seen in the game's Exp system. Following are the effects of LS + Watornado on each mob based on a Knight 163 with Health base using Sword 138 +24 donate.

 

- Bakan / Crystal / Phantasm / Spider = Dies in 1 LS + Watornado (often the mob dies, the skills continue, and I take half the life of another mob)

 

- Witch / Diabolist = I can crit up to 43k with the stacked T5.

 

- Deimoss = Sometimes he dies only with 1 LS + Watornado, when he doesn't, he loses 80% of his life.

 

- Rock = Loses an average of 60 ~ 70% of life with 1 LS + Watornado.

 

This is much more OP than any other class in the game, considering that Knight plays fantastic in everything he does. It is not fair to nerf Mage = ^ --- ^ =

Edited July 28, 2020 by Merenda

[DarkLink64 921]

Someone has to be very dumb to think Knight is bad, no one ever said that. Knight is the best balanced class of the entire game by far. And i'm glad that I've played a important role through the years to make Knight to be the way he is. Knight is the Mario of any Mario Sports game, like Mario Kart. The true "all-around".
He's good at everything but excels at nothing, only vs Undeads in 1v1.

I've only said that it doesnt have a free-win skill like you had before with Archer Perforation, and, without a free-win skill, you'll suck regardless of the class.

And hey, guess who suggested the new Mechanic of Watornado, staying in place dealing continous damage and reducing lightning resistance to combo with LS and other lightning elemental skills? It was me.  back when you didnt even played here.

Looking forward to your next class change and Fix-Knight-Please =^--^=

Edited July 28, 2020 by DarkLink64

[Tropas 32]

Bro, the fact is that you are a guy who keeps complaining about pvp, always wants to be OP. You come to complain about Archer kkkkk ... You must be very bad in pvp, the problem that will always be like this when you live in PvE .... You can exchange as many times as you want, always wanting your class to be OP. But the fact is that you are a bad player in pvp.
Want stewardship even in pvp kkkk

---

[kamuynoturno 291]

I find it funny how some people try to mock others for Change or even concert requests when she plays for 10 years with the same class and does not know how to play with her, arrives to be Hilarious, some Spend hours Thinking about how to help the Game and others just want to feel Bigger than the "Enemies" , I think it's past time to create Punishments for Certain Things in the Forum

[BigFoot 375]

47 minutes ago, Merenda said:

I don't think nerf after nerf is the solution. If Mage gets any nerfs, the class will be useless, since the class's only strength is Siege War. It doesn't make sense to nerfy a class that only does one thing in the entire game.

 

Let's go to an example of an OP class? I recently went back to the class I started on the server, Knight

 

-> I have an extremely solid PvP, I hardly die, with a shield the chances are almost zero;

 

-> Greater group control of the entire game.

 

-> And here's the most impressive. At Exp, as opposite any thought, Knight does very well! I kill a little less than an AutoMS, without sacrificing build points. LS + Watornado is the most OP thing I've ever seen in the game's Exp system. Following are the effects of LS + Watornado on each mob based on a Knight 163 with Health base using Sword 138 +24 donate.

 

- Bakan / Crystal / Phantasm / Spider = Dies in 1 LS + Watornado (often the mob dies, the skills continue, and I take half the life of another mob)

 

- Witch / Diabolist = I can crit up to 43k with the stacked T5.

 

- Deimoss = Sometimes he dies only with 1 LS + Watornado, when he doesn't, he loses 80% of his life.

 

- Rock = Loses an average of 60 ~ 70% of life with 1 LS + Watornado.

 

This is much more OP than any other class in the game, considering that Knight plays fantastic in everything he does. It is not fair to nerf Mage = ^ --- ^ =

ridiculous, LS + watornado need a knight and a mage to perform. Why you said KS OP ???? 

[Morty 68]

 

Finally the game has a strong knight. Nice change merenda ^-^

[Merenda 693]

7 minutes ago, BigFoot said:

ridiculous, LS + watornado need a knight and a mage to perform. Why you said KS OP ???? 

 

AutoMS needs a Pris to perform... But isn't the main focus of the topic, let's keep it x.x'

[BigFoot 375]

3 minutes ago, Merenda said:

 

AutoMS needs a Pris to perform... But isn't the main focus of the topic, let's keep it x.x'

so why you don't say that MG OP ????

[kamuynoturno 291]

4 minutes ago, BigFoot said:

so why you don't say that MG OP ????

Because Mage Is Not OP Mage Dies in 1 Double Crash, Any skill of another class kills mage, Wizard out of SW is useless

[BigFoot 375]

17 minutes ago, kamuynoturno said:

Because Mage Is Not OP Mage Dies in 1 Double Crash, Any skill of another class kills mage, Wizard out of SW is useless

read careful bro
 

 

1 hour ago, Merenda said:

I don't think nerf after nerf is the solution. If Mage gets any nerfs, the class will be useless, since the class's only strength is Siege War. It doesn't make sense to nerfy a class that only does one thing in the entire game.

 

Let's go to an example of an OP class? I recently went back to the class I started on the server, Knight

 

-> I have an extremely solid PvP, I hardly die, with a shield the chances are almost zero;

 

-> Greater group control of the entire game.

 

-> And here's the most impressive. At Exp, as opposite any thought, Knight does very well! I kill a little less than an AutoMS, without sacrificing build points. LS + Watornado is the most OP thing I've ever seen in the game's Exp system. Following are the effects of LS + Watornado on each mob based on a Knight 163 with Health base using Sword 138 +24 donate.

 

- Bakan / Crystal / Phantasm / Spider = Dies in 1 LS + Watornado (often the mob dies, the skills continue, and I take half the life of another mob)

 

- Witch / Diabolist = I can crit up to 43k with the stacked T5.

 

- Deimoss = Sometimes he dies only with 1 LS + Watornado, when he doesn't, he loses 80% of his life.

 

- Rock = Loses an average of 60 ~ 70% of life with 1 LS + Watornado.

 

This is much more OP than any other class in the game, considering that Knight plays fantastic in everything he does. It is not fair to nerf Mage = ^ --- ^ =

he said that LS+Watornado strong, and said that KS OP while it has to be a knight and a mage do that ?????

Edited July 28, 2020 by BigFoot

[DarkLink64 921]

Edited July 29, 2020 by DarkLink64

[nearthao 7]

Aoe is not a problem. You know...  one Mage lvl 160 has 450/500 HP whith no itens,and hes whith the best itens HP in game hes takes more and lass 1.000 HP. 

 

MmG is so squeash and useless in 1x1/5x5/10x10 because he dont  have damage.

 

For me the problem of MG is your very bad DMG 1x1 and Flame Wave dosent hit 100% of your power in PVP.

 

Is very simple to buff Flame Wave to PVP,and the skill is so balanced to PVE not have a nescessarity to re-balanced to PVP. 

 

The case of MG is so Bad  because he is the worst class  in PVP,and the people think he is godd because hes deal 300DMG AOE omg kkkkkkkkkk

[DarkLink64 921]

Edited July 29, 2020 by DarkLink64

[Merenda 693]

This is the point. Mage is not an OP class, it is a long way from it.

 

But due to ongoing complaints based on individual performance at events like Siege War, an iconic tool from our beloved RPG has literally been phased out.

 

Mages stood out simply because they have deleted the AoE skills from the other 9 classes. If Mage got nerfed, we will soon be playing Siege War as Hopis.

 

And in these sudden changes, the characters that unfortunately were most harmed were the Rangers, as their utility was based solely on their performance in Siege War due to AoE skills.

 

Unfortunately, we are currently unable to find any reason to be a Ranger. Since at the moment, they are the worst in everything they do.

[Hellnation 239]

Hey,

I saw you wrote some good points but haven't written any changes that would benefit archers.

some background:

I'm played archer in many PT servers, including ept and a edit custom items archer PT. - for over 15 years. I guess like most of us.

 

before i start - * Gm said to change our AS build so she can survive more - but lose atk pow (Aka not be a pure AS) - this is something I 10000% do not agree with as archer need to be a glass canon. 

 

now for my suggestion - adding up to your suggestion - ONLY FOR AS - I NEVER PLAYED ATA.

our beloved archer need some changes- 

Base Hp  - right now as LVL 155 archer. with all DNT items, with everything perfect, boss set 3 and enigma amulet +2 perf - I have only 980 HP.

980 hp as you all know it, nothing much - 1 hit in BC, 1-2 hits in SS, SL.. etc.. I find my self spend more gold on rebirth than anything else in game. 

I would say increase base HP or / add 2-4 points of HP each 10 agility added.

Perforation -  so perfo is THE skill for AS - supposed to deal massive amount of dmg and crit, for some reason in this server they nerfed it to a point this skill is useless and gave us bomb shot instead which makes us die x10 more because cant deactivate the skill.

Any way right now AS has like 2 skills she can use, and its seems like MS taken the archer spot against mobs.

I would suggest - make 2 different stats one for pvp and one for pve.

Armor - make "Ranger Cuepy" - which only 3 class can use - rangers as this is the most common armor for rangers this day. - add a little bit of block, abs and defense to it - and now rangers can "survive" a bit more. - funny that 120 prs have more defense and abs than a ranger 155 with full dnt set. 

 Wind arrow - this is supposed to be 1vs1 skill against mobs, right now not worth to use as bomb shot kill faster. - i would say - add 20-30% dmg to pve.

Pheonix Speed -  ok so about BC - we cant survive without phoenix shield, no matter what. It helps! but, the -40% atk rtg is just not worth it, you miss EVERYTHING in bc, doesn't matter what lvl. and its funny - SS hits the most in BC while RANGERS need to hit the most as they have the most ATK rtg.

I dont see it happened here. i would say - remove the 40% and do like "-2500 atk rtg". because the more you have atk rtg the less atk rtg you'll have eventually when you use this skill.

 

I have tons more suggestion but I know they wont be seeing so. this is for now. 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 29, 2020 by Hellnation

[Molaxx 354]

You know... i´m think the balanced not resolved only nerf our buff  X our Y class,you know? .... 

 

Honestly ,the problem is biggest them. If you think for exemple : MAGE IS TOO WEAK in PVP,and useless about some questions in DMG overall  you think the same about AS/ATS .Because AS and ATS has a good DMG in PVP,but the problem is focus on RANGER.  

 

You understand my terrible english ? (haha) Think,the problem is only Focus and the fact of ranger does not thank very well. 

 

 

But think,its not correctly?   MG have 450/500 HP  and he is so weak and die very simple.... but,its wrong ?     The wrong happens whem class to need damage ,dont have DAMAGE.

 

 

I´m think the balance as general form should be think about  the situation of the class is included.

 

 

 

[Lyseria 1,821]

5 minutes ago, Molaxx said:

Honestly ,the problem is biggest them. If you think for exemple : MAGE IS TOO WEAK in PVP

 

MG have 450/500 HP  and he is so weak and die very simple.... 

I wonder what server you are playing. ?

[Molaxx 354]

7 minutes ago, Lyseria said:

I wonder what server you are playing. ?

 

What to log my magician and see if i´m lying?