This patch balance was made to let players happy or mad?

[IronMaiden69 20]

My suggestion is make ata archer shaman mage self buff in pvp and only prs vl and t5 will be in party remain and back to original skill..

[Diell 960]

1 hour ago, RaiseAgain said:

Well like i said ,  after some tests in duel pvp  and pve in eb and lc

Bolts skill are useless for mage dia is even better then that  for sod and exp map . 

Bolt can only be good if you play 1x1 map  even tho is area skill . 

 

Flame ia still best skill for mage in pve + the use of tornado and meteor ( so why they keep nerf flame ... ?!?! ) 

About pvp  yes mage is a bit better then before 

But mage never mean to be good in pvp  he is support class  ,  so even  after this " little boost"  that even that got nerf after 1 day LOL  , mage is still ok in pvp  nothing more . 

 

Also bro , put in mind not everyone can afford or get max end game items / relics  so if admins doing change they shuold know better  that nerf will impact more on the "noobs" rahter then on the donators ... which again will create huge gap among them 

So what really change after all ? 

you notice that they always come back to the topic of magicians, they always come back to talking about flame waves, I'll be very honest with you, the problem is that people have gotten used to using magicians in this way, a character who uses his buffs and placed as a damage support away while handling other accounts, due to its ease of staying in SHIFT with a self-damage and range skill and taking a long time to cast, well that being said, mage is not and has never been a support character, mage is a killer with the highest area damage potential in the game.
People want the game team to adapt to the way they created to use the wizard, but the class is not limited to a single skill, the wizard has a range of fantastic skills, one better than the other, you just need to know how to use it at the right time, instead of that you prefer to summarize the mage as a flame wave, and saying that the mage was nerfed because of a single skill does not match the truth, despite several decreases in FW the skill remains powerful, the mage was not made to be based on FW only.
Let's learn from the mistakes of before, when flame wave had more than 200% damage, even the lowest laws 13x and 14x had very high damage, as a result of that everyone wanted to be a mage on the server, the pts had practically 6 mages, and everything was based on FW.
Today the same thing remains, they want to maintain that same style, even worse, wanting to treat magicians as a means of convenience.
Being in the mages class just for FW is one thing, and saying that the class is bad is unprocessed.
Simply too lazy to explore the immense range of skills that magicians possess.

When working with percentage, we have to balance from the highest point of the game, if I have high scales at low levels it means that when the character has 16x 17x with all the equipment and extras in the game the character would become very powerful, so the impression we have when we are at a lower level and are not as strong, until we level up and equip items to see the real potential of the class.
What you are asking for is to snort at the classes and feel this difference from an early age, and tomorrow you are complaining about how the high levels dominate the game, and the weaker ones don't have a chance.
Do you realize that you will always find a reason to complain?
Maybe they don't understand.
So let the team work.
Those who understand the game's statistics, let's stop talking about things we have no idea about.

Edited May 3, 2024 by Diell

[Femme[F]atale 197]

29 minutes ago, Diell said:

you notice that they always come back to the topic of magicians, they always come back to talking about flame waves, I'll be very honest with you, the problem is that people have gotten used to using magicians in this way, a character who uses his buffs and placed as a damage support away while handling other accounts, due to its ease of staying in SHIFT with a self-damage and range skill and taking a long time to cast, well that being said, mage is not and has never been a support character, mage is a killer with the highest area damage potential in the game.
People want the game team to adapt to the way they created to use the wizard, but the class is not limited to a single skill, the wizard has a range of fantastic skills, one better than the other, you just need to know how to use it at the right time, instead of that you prefer to summarize the mage as a flame wave, and saying that the mage was nerfed because of a single skill does not match the truth, despite several decreases in FW the skill remains powerful, the mage was not made to be based on FW only.
Let's learn from the mistakes of before, when flame wave had more than 200% damage, even the lowest laws 13x and 14x had very high damage, as a result of that everyone wanted to be a mage on the server, the pts had practically 6 mages, and everything was based on FW.
Today the same thing remains, they want to maintain that same style, even worse, wanting to treat magicians as a means of convenience.
Being in the mages class just for FW is one thing, and saying that the class is bad is unprocessed.
Simply too lazy to explore the immense range of skills that magicians possess.

When working with percentage, we have to balance from the highest point of the game, if I have high scales at low levels it means that when the character has 16x 17x with all the equipment and extras in the game the character would become very powerful, so the impression we have when we are at a lower level and are not as strong, until we level up and equip items to see the real potential of the class.
What you are asking for is to snort at the classes and feel this difference from an early age, and tomorrow you are complaining about how the high levels dominate the game, and the weaker ones don't have a chance.
Do you realize that you will always find a reason to complain?
Maybe they don't understand.
So let the team work.
Those who understand the game's statistics, let's stop talking about things we have no idea about.

 

Hello,

 

I became a magician not long ago and I had this mentality that you describe. That's playe correct your argument, thank you for making me see things differently, really, the mage is much more than flame wave, and I can speak from experience, because my mage is soon 163 and with the latest staff donate +24 and good equipment.

[Diell 960]

2 minutes ago, Femme[F]atale said:

 

Hello,

 

I became a magician not long ago and I had this mentality that you describe. That's playe correct your argument, thank you for making me see things differently, really, the mage is much more than flame wave, and I can speak from experience, because my mage is soon 163 and with the latest staff donate +24 and good equipment.

Yes, the wizard is a lot, he has such a varied range of skills that you often need to choose between one or the other, we have diastrophism with 200% damage dual hits, good area and low cost, we have watornado which is a life time skill , and several combo skills such as meteor, stone spike and sword calamite, in the most recent patch we now have fire ball with excellent damage and reasonable area.
We have elemental protection, and against debuff status due to the organic add, we can amplify all skills with elemental spirit, we have pet, area distortion to reduce many monsters to be slow, high stm and mana index, also the death radius was readjusted to the game... in the end you can use the wizard in several ways and it's not just the flame wave skill which is still very good.
Mage was one of the most worked classes lately, but people only think of flamewave and shift as something regrettable.
Not to mention that he is difficult to kill due to the energy shield, which is why people gave up as per magician, and put him in the back line.
Let's see what new fashion the players will develop now, but there's always one.

[RaiseAgain 262]

39 minutes ago, Diell said:

Yes, the wizard is a lot, he has such a varied range of skills that you often need to choose between one or the other, we have diastrophism with 200% damage dual hits, good area and low cost, we have watornado which is a life time skill , and several combo skills such as meteor, stone spike and sword calamite, in the most recent patch we now have fire ball with excellent damage and reasonable area.
We have elemental protection, and against debuff status due to the organic add, we can amplify all skills with elemental spirit, we have pet, area distortion to reduce many monsters to be slow, high stm and mana index, also the death radius was readjusted to the game... in the end you can use the wizard in several ways and it's not just the flame wave skill which is still very good.
Mage was one of the most worked classes lately, but people only think of flamewave and shift as something regrettable.
Not to mention that he is difficult to kill due to the energy shield, which is why people gave up as per magician, and put him in the back line.
Let's see what new fashion the players will develop now, but there's always one.

They shuold not change any skills  to any char . 

In my point of view  ... they shuold make all the buffs in game  as party buff ( like ass / ss buff )

Will fix all the problem with mules in bc ... will fix all the problems with extra buff from mules in eb  .. 

 

Its very simple ,, you want buff ? You need to pt the person with the buff !!!! 

 

[Dior 639]

4 hours ago, Diell said:

Oh well, it wasn't written anywhere that you were being sarcastic, nor was it understood from your text, anyone who reads it will understand something else, but ultimately.

How can you know who is an abuser or not? Did you interview each of them? You're just making vague accusations about the origin of other people's profits because you think they have too much and you have too little.
There is no way to assume other people's game play and how they get things.
It seems to me that you are trying to hold someone responsible for their gaming experience.

And to answer your question, I've been playing for over 8 years, and in the meantime I've always dropped a lot of items, both on maps and bosses, and I didn't need to play 24 hours a day, 7 days a week like you say.
It's strange that only you can't achieve things.

The fact that I've been playing for over 8 years and you've been playing for 10 doesn't make us better or different from anyone else.

You are not obliged to donate to the game if you don't want to, you are giving the wrong impression to anyone who reads your text, just based on your gaming experience.

and I also think that you are very bothered by people who donate a lot of coins, it's none of my business or yours if someone wants to donate 500kc, 300kc or 100kc, everyone does what they want with their money.
And we can be on the same level as people who donate a lot, all it takes is each person's commitment.

And about fun on the server, I never felt like at some point I stopped having that, I always have fun to this day, I look for what makes me feel good and choose how I want to play, maybe you're looking too much at other people's lives and forgetting to live your friend.

You have a very negative view of the game, try to look at the good things and don't let frustrations make your head or ruin your gaming experience.

Regarding mining, you said it doesn't make sense? like this?
For me it makes sense, because even if you already have all the relics, I can still collect ingredients to make many recipes and create food and buffs to play on the maps and increase your statistics as you prefer, collecting materials is still useful for you to sell for others played, being a source of income for you, just like many crafts in the game, and for events that exist and may come to exist, so saying that mining doesn't make sense is something exaggerated.

Hg is not just for lol level, why can't 16x and 17x go there?
there are several prizes and the ranking too, several mounts that you can complete in hg, we also have the news of the Hell chest.

Lc is not just ex drill, there are many other things there, and also xp.
If it's monotonous for some, there's a hard option that increases your chances of drops and xp.

Regarding pvp, you don't need to compare yourself to people who invest a lot of money, because everything they have we can have too, only those who invest will have everything before us, are people wrong in wanting to invest? I don't see anything wrong with that.

the community is also very toxic, there is this factor. Leave what hurts you aside and play your game.

You just seem to be tired and bored, so everything seems unmotivating to you, rest a little and then go back to playing.

Speaking of PVP for the mage, do you think that 87% as a general multiplier is a low value?
This 87% will be incorporated in all your skills, added to your status points and level + relics and gems + your weapon and external buffs.
taking into account the characteristics of each class, what it can do and how it influences other classes.
People have to stop thinking that when the team does a balance it is just a number that is in the visual skill formula in the eyes, there is a whole dynamic involved until it reaches a factor.
So many come and look at that number and start saying it's a buff or nerf, and they despair.
You should trust the team more, they know what they are doing.
Much of what is said by some people here are exaggerations, expectations and realities are very different.
If they are moving it is because adjustments need to be made.
And it's also good to think for yourself and not get carried away by the herd effect of what many people say lightly.

This is so much nonsense.

 

enjoy your stay.

[Diell 960]

36 minutes ago, RaiseAgain said:

They shuold not change any skills  to any char . 

In my point of view  ... they shuold make all the buffs in game  as party buff ( like ass / ss buff )

Will fix all the problem with mules in bc ... will fix all the problems with extra buff from mules in eb  .. 

 

Its very simple ,, you want buff ? You need to pt the person with the buff !!!! 

 

the changes may have been necessary, we don't know, the only people who may be aware of this are the programmers who have access to the game's Matrix, so let's not jump to conclusions, after all this could all be part of a bigger update, which will bring new features , as far as we know there will be a bigger patch coming soon, this was just preparation.  If we stop shouting in Dev's ears a little, they can focus more.  And about buffs only in parties, yes it is an interesting idea to consider.  Build a well-designed agenda, and know how to convey your ideas in a light and interesting way, and maybe you'll start to be heard.

21 minutes ago, Dior said:

This is so much nonsense.

 

enjoy your stay.

nothing more to add for you.  Improvements

[Feedbacker 5]

14 hours ago, Overlady said:

DP already got a considerable boost in damage for PvE, we will consider for PvP too.

 

Best,

Overlady

Hm, so my gut feeling was right. Changes for change's sake.

Can't even fanthom the idea that someone is disrespectfully enough to conceive this.
Devine Piercing is a staple much like Charged Strike, Destroyer, Shadow Master...

So I was right. The option of keeping it at level 8 really never crossed the minds of who made the changes. With that kind of reply, it is clear that the designer simply didn't knew the game enough and forgot that Knights could keep the skill at lv 8 and use a faster, 5 hit version of Devine Piercing.

Rushed decisions leads to mad players who got direspected. 


If the designer of this, actually did changes for compelling reasons, instead from changing for change's sake, current values could be applied to Lv8.

Then, Lv9 and Lv10 could have a lower values. So, players would RECEIVE new options and Knights could play safer with a quicker, 5 hits DP, or play with more risk with a 7 hits DP that could deal a bit more of DPS.

But lets remove the 7 hits, nobody will care.

Edited May 3, 2024 by Feedbacker

[Overlady 5,238]

We have an end goal of balancing that we are implementing over time, but we are addressing it in various aspects because we understand that a drastic change is not always welcome. We still need to adjust other party buffs, but most of them require reworking the code, which is not an easy task.

 

The class has many "similar" skills intentionally. We no longer have the same emphasis on specific builds as we did in the past, partly because of the availability of skill points. Now most characters have 2-3 skill options to maximize their DPS. Let's take the priestess as an example:

Holy Bolt: Provides good damage, especially effective against undead enemies, allowing for safer gameplay from a longer range.
Multi Spark: Damage output varies significantly, with a bonus against mechanical enemies and additional benefits when paired with Watornado.
Vigor Ball: Although its animation is slower, it delivers two hits and is safer to use against bosses due to its higher attack rating.

 

 

Just to address the past nerfs on the magician: Before I joined the team, there was a significant rework on Project Zeus, where many of his skills were changed. Burn was added to many skills, and Watornado became a DoT ability with a lightning bonus... Those changes twisted the original class identity drastically, turning him into an overpowered ranged one-skill wonder.

Flame Wave: Flame Wave was not intended to be a spammable skill. The classic magician rotation used to be Dias > FW > Meteorite. By making Flame Wave spammable, he transitioned from a mid-range to a full-range character, which wasn't appropriate. His AoE DPS used to surpass that of ANY class in 1x1 DPS, except for Automech (which was also boosted back then). Nowadays, he still has the highest AoE damage in the game because we nerfed it and buffed his and other classes 1x1 damage.

Dancing Sword: Dancing Sword was incredibly powerful. I'm not sure if you remember, but only Dancing Sword, without any other action, used to outperform the damage of a Brawler (and most melee classes, before the melee rework) in a full rotation.

Stone Spike: Stone Spike has always been difficult to balance. If used very close to the monster, it would become insanely powerful, but if the monster was on the edge of its range, the damage would be negligible. It fits the magician's design but was easily exploitable if kept spammable. You could just stick to the target and spam Stone Spike to once again outperform every other class in 1x1 damage. By adding cooldown to stone spike, the Dias buff replaced it.

 

Best,

Overlady

[Capybara 506]

(Solution for PVP issue. - Suggestions)

 

A problem that was "predicted" years ago. All this discussion about "HK and high Dmg" was mentioned and ignored; everything could have been corrected and thought out beforehand if the staff simply communicated with the community in advance so that we could discuss the matter. Many people left after spending so much time discussing, wanting to help, and being ignored.

 

What remains for us is to wait another +2 years for the Shop Offline (REWORK IN SHOPS - Suggestions) problem to be resolved...

 

 

the life snake~

[BigFoot 375]

16 minutes ago, Overlady said:

We have an end goal of balancing that we are implementing over time, but we are addressing it in various aspects because we understand that a drastic change is not always welcome. We still need to adjust other party buffs, but most of them require reworking the code, which is not an easy task.

 

The class has many "similar" skills intentionally. We no longer have the same emphasis on specific builds as we did in the past, partly because of the availability of skill points. Now most characters have 2-3 skill options to maximize their DPS. Let's take the priestess as an example:

Holy Bolt: Provides good damage, especially effective against undead enemies, allowing for safer gameplay from a longer range.
Multi Spark: Damage output varies significantly, with a bonus against mechanical enemies and additional benefits when paired with Watornado.
Vigor Ball: Although its animation is slower, it delivers two hits and is safer to use against bosses due to its higher attack rating.

 

 

Just to address the past nerfs on the magician: Before I joined the team, there was a significant rework on Project Zeus, where many of his skills were changed. Burn was added to many skills, and Watornado became a DoT ability with a lightning bonus... Those changes twisted the original class identity drastically, turning him into an overpowered ranged one-skill wonder.

Flame Wave: Flame Wave was not intended to be a spammable skill. The classic magician rotation used to be Dias > FW > Meteorite. By making Flame Wave spammable, he transitioned from a mid-range to a full-range character, which wasn't appropriate. His AoE DPS used to surpass that of ANY class in 1x1 DPS, except for Automech (which was also boosted back then). Nowadays, he still has the highest AoE damage in the game because we nerfed it and buffed his and other classes 1x1 damage.

Dancing Sword: Dancing Sword was incredibly powerful. I'm not sure if you remember, but only Dancing Sword, without any other action, used to outperform the damage of a Brawler (and most melee classes, before the melee rework) in a full rotation.

Stone Spike: Stone Spike has always been difficult to balance. If used very close to the monster, it would become insanely powerful, but if the monster was on the edge of its range, the damage would be negligible. It fits the magician's design but was easily exploitable if kept spammable. You could just stick to the target and spam Stone Spike to once again outperform every other class in 1x1 damage. By adding cooldown to stone spike, the Dias buff replaced it.

 

Best,

Overlady

Sorry, but don't just talk about skill rotation in theory like this. Please play the game only once and see that the magician rotation cannot include Dias or Stone Spike. These are non target skills, so it's not just like switching skills to rotate, it requires a right mouse click and it's not suitable for rotating skills. I'm sure NOBODY in this game does skill rotation with Dias and Stone Spike because it's too exhausted to do for more than a minute. Please exclude all non-targeted skills from the rotation.
PLEASE play the game but don't just say it in theory like this.

Edited May 3, 2024 by BigFoot

[- D E A T H S T R O K E - 1,764]

20 minutes ago, Overlady said:

We have an end goal of balancing that we are implementing over time, but we are addressing it in various aspects because we understand that a drastic change is not always welcome. We still need to adjust other party buffs, but most of them require reworking the code, which is not an easy task.

virtual life, hall of vahalha and FoN should also get the Axe

hall of vahalha is really broken as it gives AoE evade, more broken than Draxos due to this, while giving atk power. Most of class, like Brawler and KS, are obviously not meant to have such evade.

FoN gives atk power and atk rtg.

VL is the hardest one to balance as it would need to rework damage across the entire game. Everything was balanced around it, but in my opinion it doesn't make sense to be forced to have a mule priest giving you VL to do anything in the game. Why you get +10% extra abs from monsters if monsters can just have less dmg?

[HollyShot 1,005]

27 minutes ago, Overlady said:

We have an end goal of balancing that we are implementing over time, but we are addressing it in various aspects because we understand that a drastic change is not always welcome. We still need to adjust other party buffs, but most of them require reworking the code, which is not an easy task.

 

The class has many "similar" skills intentionally. We no longer have the same emphasis on specific builds as we did in the past, partly because of the availability of skill points. Now most characters have 2-3 skill options to maximize their DPS. Let's take the priestess as an example:

Holy Bolt: Provides good damage, especially effective against undead enemies, allowing for safer gameplay from a longer range.
Multi Spark: Damage output varies significantly, with a bonus against mechanical enemies and additional benefits when paired with Watornado.
Vigor Ball: Although its animation is slower, it delivers two hits and is safer to use against bosses due to its higher attack rating.

 

 

Just to address the past nerfs on the magician: Before I joined the team, there was a significant rework on Project Zeus, where many of his skills were changed. Burn was added to many skills, and Watornado became a DoT ability with a lightning bonus... Those changes twisted the original class identity drastically, turning him into an overpowered ranged one-skill wonder.

Flame Wave: Flame Wave was not intended to be a spammable skill. The classic magician rotation used to be Dias > FW > Meteorite. By making Flame Wave spammable, he transitioned from a mid-range to a full-range character, which wasn't appropriate. His AoE DPS used to surpass that of ANY class in 1x1 DPS, except for Automech (which was also boosted back then). Nowadays, he still has the highest AoE damage in the game because we nerfed it and buffed his and other classes 1x1 damage.

Dancing Sword: Dancing Sword was incredibly powerful. I'm not sure if you remember, but only Dancing Sword, without any other action, used to outperform the damage of a Brawler (and most melee classes, before the melee rework) in a full rotation.

Stone Spike: Stone Spike has always been difficult to balance. If used very close to the monster, it would become insanely powerful, but if the monster was on the edge of its range, the damage would be negligible. It fits the magician's design but was easily exploitable if kept spammable. You could just stick to the target and spam Stone Spike to once again outperform every other class in 1x1 damage. By adding cooldown to stone spike, the Dias buff replaced it.

 

Best,

Overlady

The problem about buffs is that the previously balances were made counting on them. If you intend to remove all buffs, and im ok with that, then you should remake all the balance again. 
Yesterday you gave back a bit of our damage in pvp, but the classes are still unbalanced, specially magic classes, rangers and pike/ass. When you nerfed everyone's damage, these classes have become inferior to melee (tanker) classes, since is just too easy for them to tank. I have been playing brawler these days and it's just impressive how god mode it is.

In my opinion, you have some options to balance, by giving back the enchant weapon/divine force buffs, or nerfing "tanker buffs" (VL/EVD), or giving direct buffs to these classes.
MS still looks weak too, maybe you should consider one more buff, i suggest in his atk rating. Thanks.

[Overlady 5,238]

15 minutes ago, BigFoot said:

Sorry, but don't just talk about skill rotation in theory like this. Please play the game only once and see that the magician rotation cannot include Dias or Stone Spike. These are non target skills, so it's not just like switching skills to rotate, it requires a right mouse click and it's not suitable for rotating skills. I'm sure NOBODY in this game does skill rotation with Dias and Stone Spike because it's too exhausted to do for more than a minute. Please exclude all non-targeted skills from the rotation.
PLEASE play the game but don't just say it in theory like this.

You can cast any non-target skill only with keyboard, don't need to click. But I do agree it is a bit uncomfortable, when mixing target and non-target. Anyway, magician is just fine DPS wise just with FW+Meteorite or Dias+SS(can be manageable only with shift+key, with no click), you dont need to do the full rotation.

 

8 minutes ago, - D E A T H S T R O K E - said:

virtual life, hall of vahalha and FoN should also get the Axe

hall of vahalha is really broken as it gives AoE evade, more broken than Draxos due to this, while giving atk power. Most of class, like Brawler and KS, are obviously not meant to have such evade.

FoN gives atk power and atk rtg.

VL is the hardest one to balance as it would need to rework damage across the entire game. Everything was balanced around it, but in my opinion it doesn't make sense to be forced to have a mule priest giving you VL to do anything in the game. Why you get +10% extra abs from monsters if monsters can just have less dmg?

HoV always gives /2 for both attack and evade, but there's still an 11% evasion. The same goes for FON. Assassin's Alas still provides full evasion, and the same goes for Shaman and other buffs.

We aim to do the same for VL, but in a manner that injects the lost health from the nerf into the base health of the character.

 

Best,

Overlady

[- D E A T H S T R O K E - 1,764]

15 minutes ago, Overlady said:

HoV always gives /2 for both attack and evade, but there's still an 11% evasion.

i know, but the problem is: 11% AoE evade is simply broken for a skill, it's stronger than Draxos as it allows you to evade debuffs as well.

it would be better to add evade to one of atalanta's passive and reduce HoV Evade.

Edited May 3, 2024 by - D E A T H S T R O K E -

[miiros 79]

1 hour ago, Overlady said:

We have an end goal of balancing that we are implementing over time, but we are addressing it in various aspects because we understand that a drastic change is not always welcome. We still need to adjust other party buffs, but most of them require reworking the code, which is not an easy task.

 

The class has many "similar" skills intentionally. We no longer have the same emphasis on specific builds as we did in the past, partly because of the availability of skill points. Now most characters have 2-3 skill options to maximize their DPS. Let's take the priestess as an example:

Holy Bolt: Provides good damage, especially effective against undead enemies, allowing for safer gameplay from a longer range.
Multi Spark: Damage output varies significantly, with a bonus against mechanical enemies and additional benefits when paired with Watornado.
Vigor Ball: Although its animation is slower, it delivers two hits and is safer to use against bosses due to its higher attack rating.

 

 

Just to address the past nerfs on the magician: Before I joined the team, there was a significant rework on Project Zeus, where many of his skills were changed. Burn was added to many skills, and Watornado became a DoT ability with a lightning bonus... Those changes twisted the original class identity drastically, turning him into an overpowered ranged one-skill wonder.

Flame Wave: Flame Wave was not intended to be a spammable skill. The classic magician rotation used to be Dias > FW > Meteorite. By making Flame Wave spammable, he transitioned from a mid-range to a full-range character, which wasn't appropriate. His AoE DPS used to surpass that of ANY class in 1x1 DPS, except for Automech (which was also boosted back then). Nowadays, he still has the highest AoE damage in the game because we nerfed it and buffed his and other classes 1x1 damage.

Dancing Sword: Dancing Sword was incredibly powerful. I'm not sure if you remember, but only Dancing Sword, without any other action, used to outperform the damage of a Brawler (and most melee classes, before the melee rework) in a full rotation.

Stone Spike: Stone Spike has always been difficult to balance. If used very close to the monster, it would become insanely powerful, but if the monster was on the edge of its range, the damage would be negligible. It fits the magician's design but was easily exploitable if kept spammable. You could just stick to the target and spam Stone Spike to once again outperform every other class in 1x1 damage. By adding cooldown to stone spike, the Dias buff replaced it.

 

Best,

Overlady

Hi staff. We had a good balance in pvp before this patch, except for 3 classes = Brawler (op), Pike (op when play hit and run), Mechanic (trash). 
I believe you should make a balance in the classes that need balance only, when you made changes for all classes, the balance became worst.
Now you see everyone will change class for FS and BS, and all other classes will be below them. And why?
I think nobody enjoys to keep taking buffs,  but removing buffs for all, you need understand that affects each class in a different way. Classes that are usual tankers, now are almost impossible to kill alone, always need many players to take down one char. 
Shaman 17x having hard time to kill 160 chars, Mage low hp and low damage, Archers are just trash useless cant tank cant kill, Atalanta same of AS, MS still bad missing all hits, Pikes that supposed to hit kill are useless. 
All because of lack of damage. Please consider something to increase the damage in pvp. Like the owner of the topic said, now all we have are "crowd wars", who has more players is just impossible to lose.

For mage in PVE, we don't want to use a tier1 skill  (fire ball) for exp, Flave wave was not a mistake by the staff in my opinion, remember that mage is mostly a PVE class, having a support role in pvp. You improved one skill from tier 1 that nobody uses (FW still better) and just nerf our main skill. 
If you want us using fire ball, you will need buff more this skill, so it worths, not nerfing Flame wave. 
 

[Mjizzy_7 1,986]

7 minutes ago, - D E A T H S T R O K E - said:

i know, but the problem is: 11% AoE evade is simply broken for a skill, it's stronger than Draxos as it allows you to evade debuffs as well.

it would be better to add evade to one of atalanta's passive and reduce HoV Evade.

I remember once the staff nerfed hov. The people bevame so mad. Now its asked again. 

[BigFoot 375]

35 minutes ago, Overlady said:

You can cast any non-target skill only with keyboard, don't need to click. But I do agree it is a bit uncomfortable, when mixing target and non-target. Anyway, magician is just fine DPS wise just with FW+Meteorite or Dias+SS(can be manageable only with shift+key, with no click), you dont need to do the full rotation.

 

Dias + SS is also uncomfortable, it needs to spam 3 times Dias and 3 times SS each rotation. Personally, I don't do Dias + SS. Stone Spike is not worth rotating (damage and range are nothing remarkable compared to Dias), just Dias is fine.
FW + Meteorite has absolutely not effective on DPS because Meteorite has too long casting time. I can cast FW twice instead of switching to Meteorite ^^
The idea of skill rotation is good but needs to be more effective. Currently it's qu.ite unconvincing 🤷‍♂️

Edited May 3, 2024 by BigFoot

[Mjizzy_7 1,986]

8 minutes ago, miiros said:

Hi staff. We had a good balance in pvp before this patch, except for 3 classes = Brawler (op), Pike (op when play hit and run), Mechanic (trash). 
I believe you should make a balance in the classes that need balance only, when you made changes for all classes, the balance became worst.
Now you see everyone will change class for FS and BS, and all other classes will be below them. And why?
I think nobody enjoys to keep taking buffs,  but removing buffs for all, you need understand that affects each class in a different way. Classes that are usual tankers, now are almost impossible to kill alone, always need many players to take down one char. 
Shaman 17x having hard time to kill 160 chars, Mage low hp and low damage, Archers are just trash useless cant tank cant kill, Atalanta same of AS, MS still bad missing all hits, Pikes that supposed to hit kill are useless. 
All because of lack of damage. Please consider something to increase the damage in pvp. Like the owner of the topic said, now all we have are "crowd wars", who has more players is just impossible to lose.

For mage in PVE, we don't want to use a tier1 skill  (fire ball) for exp, Flave wave was not a mistake by the staff in my opinion, remember that mage is mostly a PVE class, having a support role in pvp. You improved one skill from tier 1 that nobody uses (FW still better) and just nerf our main skill. 
If you want us using fire ball, you will need buff more this skill, so it worths, not nerfing Flame wave. 
 

I dont know what is again ur problem. U want a 164 ps hk every other class. I know your side went full on pike but u need wake up that a 160 ps cant hk all time. Most players ur fighting are 165+ . Go get a 168+ pike with full items he will still hk. Just understand its over with low lvl that abuse hk. People should start invest in lvl, items instead of crying the whole day on forum 

[miiros 79]

5 minutes ago, Mjizzy_7 said:

I dont know what is again ur problem. U want a 164 ps hk every other class. I know your side went full on pike but u need wake up that a 160 ps cant hk all time. Most players ur fighting are 165+ . Go get a 168+ pike with full items he will still hk. Just understand its over with low lvl that abuse hk. People should start invest in lvl, items instead of crying the whole day on forum 

Read again my post, i talked about ALL classes not only pike. You were the first that changed to FS to abuse a broken class. Pike always count on his hit kill to pvp, because he is not that good to 1v1 against other classes if he can't HK. 
This is not the only class that is bad, like i said in my posts, rangers are dead classes, magic classes became just support = mage dist mule, shaman speed mule, prs holy mind mule. 
Don't try to make this topic a clan war, we just want a fair pvp for ALL classes, not only your favorite melee.

[Mjizzy_7 1,986]

4 minutes ago, miiros said:

Read again my post, i talked about ALL classes not only pike. You were the first that changed to FS to abuse a broken class. Pike always count on his hit kill to pvp, because he is not that good to 1v1 against other classes if he can't HK. 
This is not the only class that is bad, like i said in my posts, rangers are dead classes, magic classes became just support = mage dist mule, shaman speed mule, prs holy mind mule. 
Don't try to make this topic a clan war, we just want a fair pvp for ALL classes, not only your favorite melee.

Im not making a clan war. I just cant understand the problem. If you use the right premiums u still can do a high dmg. 
I still see people are able to make hk but not on everyone. Bs is the only chara that is to tanky yet. And about * broken Fs* You will see when more going to change that he is not broken. You want to compare a 172 with full of all with others this will not make any sense. 
You talk Rangers are bad. Where is 1 Ranger who were in war complaining here? 
 

its really weird. DtmNaja DtmCain had a crazy dmg last war. 
 

Pikes who were last war in bc were maximum 165. Still they made good kills and dmg. But what ur expecting? 
 

Ba-lisa is ata. Crazy Dmg so strong

 

The Arguements are abit weird. 

 

[namco9x 21]

This patch so good patch. More problem

fixed!!!

[miiros 79]

8 minutes ago, Mjizzy_7 said:

Im not making a clan war. I just cant understand the problem. If you use the right premiums u still can do a high dmg. 
I still see people are able to make hk but not on everyone. Bs is the only chara that is to tanky yet. And about * broken Fs* You will see when more going to change that he is not broken. You want to compare a 172 with full of all with others this will not make any sense. 
You talk Rangers are bad. Where is 1 Ranger who were in war complaining here? 
 

its really weird. DtmNaja DtmCain had a crazy dmg last war. 
 

Pikes who were last war in bc were maximum 165. Still they made good kills and dmg. But what ur expecting? 
 

Ba-lisa is ata. Crazy Dmg so strong

 

The Arguements are abit weird. 

 

I think you need understand that most players of the game are NOT 17x. Pike 165 should be strong at pvp. The balance has to be made for the majority of the players, not for the top20 ranking. 
Rangers are bad, you said naja and cain are good? Cain has 1.5 k/d, Naja has 0.9. You said ba-lisa is good? Ata 17x full gears 1.5 k/d (i think most of them made while she was BS, atalanta for sure even worst). And these supposed to be the best players of theses classes (according to you).
Brawler and FS are above all other classes because they can tank like hell (cuz lack of dmg of other classes) + kill like hell (high dmg).

[urdead123 84]

@Overlady

 

I think the new balancing system makes sense, and i cannnot wait for the upcoming additions to it. I dont blame the community for being upset with it, the community is very use to having a lot of power where they can hit kill opponents in 1 hit or 2..3 hits more consistently, but i enjoy this new pvp better because it allows for more engaging PVP,  people die less by constant one hit kills. 

 

For me , i think its more fun where the fight between an opponent can last at least a minute, because an immediate hit kill that is frequent with classes is just overkill and boring. Reducing the damage with the party buffs made a lot of sense and i think you should continue that with the ata buff and ect... having our independent characters more reliant and dependent on our own skill sets/ builds just makes a lot of sense.

 

I honestly think in PVP the only class who needs help is MS, continue to nerf the party buffs and allow the classes to perform with their skill sets, and continue to create a more engaging pvp experience that involves less hit kills

 

 

 

And to be clear, even after the less damage for hit kill classes  :

 

Pikes can still hit kill enough

assasins can still hit kill enough

archers can still deal massive damage and obtain many kills

 

It's just not as frequent as before which might take some time for people to get use too. 

 

 

overall great work, i look forward to the final update of the balance

2 hours ago, miiros said:

I think you need understand that most players of the game are NOT 17x. Pike 165 should be strong at pvp. The balance has to be made for the majority of the players, not for the top20 ranking. 
Rangers are bad, you said naja and cain are good? Cain has 1.5 k/d, Naja has 0.9. You said ba-lisa is good? Ata 17x full gears 1.5 k/d (i think most of them made while she was BS, atalanta for sure even worst). And these supposed to be the best players of theses classes (according to you).
Brawler and FS are above all other classes because they can tank like hell (cuz lack of dmg of other classes) + kill like hell (high dmg).

 

 

you said fs and brawler can tank like hell because of lesser dmg due to the damage nerfs of other classes, which also means all  classes can tank a little better because the overall damage was reduced of all classes due to party buff reductions. of course fs brawler will tank like hell with their skill sets fs high hp brawler dmg reduction its just their skill sets, but for example with ata and archer, they are able to defend a little better than before because the dmg was reduced by all characters. 

 

I think all classes except mechanic do great damage, its just not the type of damage we are use to but that doesnt mean its bad, PVP i think is finally changing in this game and its going in the right direction

Edited May 3, 2024 by urdead123
edit

[Mjizzy_7 1,986]

2 hours ago, miiros said:

I think you need understand that most players of the game are NOT 17x. Pike 165 should be strong at pvp. The balance has to be made for the majority of the players, not for the top20 ranking. 
Rangers are bad, you said naja and cain are good? Cain has 1.5 k/d, Naja has 0.9. You said ba-lisa is good? Ata 17x full gears 1.5 k/d (i think most of them made while she was BS, atalanta for sure even worst). And these supposed to be the best players of theses classes (according to you).
Brawler and FS are above all other classes because they can tank like hell (cuz lack of dmg of other classes) + kill like hell (high dmg).

Ps cannot kill 🙂 165 Pike. Fs is tanker     1 Pic say more then words

Edited May 3, 2024 by Mjizzy_7