Weapon Status Imbalance

[cybercyber 0]

@Topic

 

Weapons aren´t UNbalanced(not IMbalance how u said), look it: Swords are "exclusive" for Knight and maybe Mechs, Have high critical and make easy critical than other weapons, and have low Max atk pow and High low atk to make more a almost equal dmg, so if u hurt someone a lot, almost all time you will remove that hit almost always, unless u get a critical, SW have a nice critical hate, and other, Knights are super fast with GM, think how will stay if have a fast GC + High dmg = To hell!

Now Axes, almost same thing of Swords, but have some differences: Low atk pow is almost same of a SW, but your Max atk pow is high comparing a SW and have a small proximity of Scythes (i said SMALL).Axes dont reiceve Critical on agings because they are exclusive yes, EXCLUSIVE for Fighters, and fighters have skills which already reiceve critical as AV and Destroyer, so think what the hell will going on if plus Wp Critical + skill critical + High, high, veeeery High dmg from Fighters, no one will get use potions with hell damage.And they reiceve more Atk Rtg because if u look well ,if u a nice looker, you will see they miss a lot of hits, and they need a small extra Atk RTG to get some hits on yours opponents. Same thing is valid to Hammers of mechs.

Now, Scythes. Pikes have a lot of criticals , defensive skills and with a bonus: Atk RTG based on weapon add

Look well and you´ll see if they have a balanced Atk Pow very balanced how u are arguing also, They will hurt a lot like fighter, will have a balanced Atk Pow like Swords, nice Atk RTG (very nice 2k or almost 2k RTG oO), and will tank like hell, nice char to pvp , isn´t huh?

 

So... We dont need a weapon balance, because if we have this kind of balance, we will get really , REEEEEAAALLLLYYY unbalanced.

[DarkLink64 921]

Stop making all chars are same~

 

This ^. No one wants to play 8 versions of the same thing, which is where all your ideas lead and we debated this on a different thread. Your in complete denial that this is what you're really asking for.

 

Neither me. I do want to play a game with 8 fully balanced classes. On every aspect. I'm striving for balance. If you think this will make all the chars the same thing, go play League of Legends, a game that have 90 characters and they're balanced. Do people think that one character is a copy of everyone? No. Do people think that balanced game is boring and quit the game? No. Everyone have it's strenght, also it weakness, and when things goes out of control, they can counter everyone. I'm not talking to people quit Pt and play LoL, i'm wanting to help Wartale to reach at least a bit of this balancing level.

 

Also, answer me: Do you know what is "Balance"?

 

For me, Balance is when you pick a class, play it and doesn't get frustrated because when you lose at something, but you know that you can win if you raise your playskill, mindgame, response time, whatsoever. Do you like to be 1 hit KOed? Well, i DON'T like it. And 1 HIT KO is a thing that are stuck on Priston Origins (Hello Pike). People that usually plays RPT have close minded to game balance concept as a whole, because imbalance is present since ever on Priston Tale. That's why people dont like it or do fake balance suggestion, aiming advantages for itself.

 

Again, what use is balancing weapons when you throw skills into the balance? So what if a pike gets lower attack on their weapon? You sit here q.qing about AC when CL hits THREE times at 66%. Also complaining FS got the 15% crit on AC? Ya, thats PASSIVE on pike. This is excluding things like assassin eye and vanish as well.

 

I think you didnt read it right. It was a example of a unfair fight with a 1 handed axe against 2 handed sword / scythe, leading to my question, 30 WEAPON atk damage or 10% critical? Don't forget 30 WEAPON atk damage is WAY noticeable, because all formulas start by your weapon. Personally if my job allow, i would pick wep dmg over critical.

 

Perhaps you're not bias, but if you're not, then I with many other people are wondering what you're smoking. All your ideas look at the narrowest possible viewpoint of a situation, exclude all the variables they're intertwined with, then make a simple conclusion to a much larger problem.

 

Excluding variables? This is something you can't say. Really. I do not say things without thinking and covering almost EVERY aspect of the game. You can see it clearly on all my suggestions that i've already did on this forum, regarding everything. To me, people QQ everyday about balance issue, what i'm trying is to balance the entire game as a whole, to reach a point when everyone is able to have fun without being frustrated by non-human levels (you've failed because of virtual reasons, not for your lack of playskill)

 

Sure, go balance your weapons, then we have to go doing even more balancing to skills. Things get nerfed, ppl q.q, and it's a huge mess to end up with the equivalent of where you started. Pointless work isn't something we need to be adding. Weapon imbalances are also very costly to the whole server, since they aren't automatically updated, you either have to find or buy a new one. Only severe imbalances need to be corrected on weapons because of this issue, such as the orbs vs shields and the bow vs other 2h problem.

 

Balancing skills is way more easier with balanced weapons, but, unlike you said that i'm excluding variables, with balanced gears, you're automatically excluding many things when doing balancing. Also, it isnt impossible to change a existing item on the game, what is happening is, Wartale doesn't have the tool or a script to do that. We're talking about Database, not the game itself. If he says that is IMPOSSIBLE to develop a script to change some values on the database, then i'll shut myself up. If you want to balance, you should do everything related on this matter.

 

To be honest, all i can see is people covering themselves, faking that they want balance the game, but they don't want to put their head on the table, they dont want to give up their overpower characterist for everyone else balance sake. I'll be a liar if i dont say that i dont do it, but, to prevent being impartial with my favourite class, i'm trying to hit other things that people usually don't notice, that i believe will help the balancing work as a whole. 

 

I'll just ask something, to everyone.

 

If you don't want to balance the game AS A WHOLE, assume the fact that you like unbalance. It's impossible to reach Balance without making each class more closer to one to another. This mean, making class gameplay a little more the same over all classes.

 

But that can be changed. My dream is when Realm PT would put a delay on every spammable skill, making other skills usefull, playing with combo of skills.

 

Do you think i like to just spam brandish or Grand Cross? No.

 

My dream is when i would be able to use almost every active skill of my character. The game can be balanced without making 8 versions of the same thing.

 

Sure. Pike can do it, comboing it's skills, but other class can not. What i want most is to use GC, DC, T2 Piercing, T4 Piercing, as a whole combo.

 

 

Off course this can require a lot of time. But, dream on your favorite game isn't prohibited.

 

 

[1337person 0]

Every single MMO has different damages for different types of weapons and different classes get different bonuses depending on the weapon they're using.

 

And your posts do reek of class favouritism - especially for knights.

 

Your calculations do not matter because you don't see mechs or even FS being too OP. What matters is the end result. If the weapon damage difference between two different types of weapons was huge, it is still completely irrelevant to balance since skills, passive and active, contribute to multiplying and increasing this damage. If you want all weapons to have the same damage range, then all skills would have to be "balanced" to have the exact same, identical increases in damage. This would make all classes the same.

 

Balance does not mean uniformity. It means balancing strengths and weaknesses. If a class is weak in an area, it is strong in another. What you want is a = b = c.

[[Zurita] 12]

@Topic

 

Weapons aren´t UNbalanced(not IMbalance how u said), look it: Swords are "exclusive" for Knight and maybe Mechs, Have high critical and make easy critical than other weapons, and have low Max atk pow and High low atk to make more a almost equal dmg, so if u hurt someone a lot, almost all time you will remove that hit almost always, unless u get a critical, SW have a nice critical hate, and other, Knights are super fast with GM, think how will stay if have a fast GC + High dmg = To hell!

Now Axes, almost same thing of Swords, but have some differences: Low atk pow is almost same of a SW, but your Max atk pow is high comparing a SW and have a small proximity of Scythes (i said SMALL).Axes dont reiceve Critical on agings because they are exclusive yes, EXCLUSIVE for Fighters, and fighters have skills which already reiceve critical as AV and Destroyer, so think what the hell will going on if plus Wp Critical + skill critical + High, high, veeeery High dmg from Fighters, no one will get use potions with hell damage.And they reiceve more Atk Rtg because if u look well ,if u a nice looker, you will see they miss a lot of hits, and they need a small extra Atk RTG to get some hits on yours opponents. Same thing is valid to Hammers of mechs.

Now, Scythes. Pikes have a lot of criticals , defensive skills and with a bonus: Atk RTG based on weapon add

Look well and you´ll see if they have a balanced Atk Pow very balanced how u are arguing also, They will hurt a lot like fighter, will have a balanced Atk Pow like Swords, nice Atk RTG (very nice 2k or almost 2k RTG oO), and will tank like hell, nice char to pvp , isn´t huh?

 

So... We dont need a weapon balance, because if we have this kind of balance, we will get really , REEEEEAAALLLLYYY unbalanced.

 

Good Explanation.   8)

[Gogg 3]

Let's take it this way

 

As you, darklink, say, and everyone seem to think the same, the balace goes on pros and cons of each class.

 

So weak weapons is on the "con list" of knights anh pikes ^.~

 

Done.

[4EvaLegend 0]

It's hard to argue with someone who only sees things through a knight point of view. Half the stuff you ever mention is rooted in how terribly bias you are with knight, and not being able to see anything but comparing your weakness to the strength of another class. Most of the complaints here suggest knight is OP if anything, and it is.

 

Knight was actually my main character on ePT, and I leveled through the high 80s with no help when you could still count the number of 9xs on the server with just your hands. Needless to say, I got tons of experience with KS and how it is supposed to play. I don't know how knight got to be what it was here, but that is FAR from anything it ever was. If you've ever heard the phrase "jack of all trades, master of none", this was KS in a nutshell. Ks is supposed to be about 3rd to 5th in every category, not bad but at anything but not great at it either.

 

KS here has given you the impression that you're supposed to AoE like a prs, kill like a pike/fs and then tank like a mech. That is simply wrong, knight is not supposed to be on par with the best of any class in any category. Pike/FS should clearly have the advantage over you in PvP, mech should far out tank you, and prs/mage shouldn't even be a contest with AoE. The advantage is while the FS may have the advantage for killing you in PvP, you don't have to go stick with a horrible PvE for leveling, that is when you're better. You may not AoE in exping like a prs either, but then you don't have to have atrocious 1 v 1, that is when you're better than them.

 

KS is far too strong and this weapon balance idea just comes from the fact that you actually think it's weak, when it is very strong.

wait you play ePT?? me toooo

back on topic I agree. You want to point out the imbalance take a look at the servers qty of classes. Stop trying to make knight stronger then they already are.

[4EvaLegend 0]

Stop making all chars are same~

 

This ^. No one wants to play 8 versions of the same thing, which is where all your ideas lead and we debated this on a different thread. Your in complete denial that this is what you're really asking for.

 

Neither me. I do want to play a game with 8 fully balanced classes. On every aspect. I'm striving for balance. If you think this will make all the chars the same thing, go play League of Legends, a game that have 90 characters and they're balanced. Do people think that one character is a copy of everyone? No. Do people think that balanced game is boring and quit the game? No. Everyone have it's strenght, also it weakness, and when things goes out of control, they can counter everyone. I'm not talking to people quit Pt and play LoL, i'm wanting to help Wartale to reach at least a bit of this balancing level.

 

Also, answer me: Do you know what is "Balance"?

 

For me, Balance is when you pick a class, play it and doesn't get frustrated because when you lose at something, but you know that you can win if you raise your playskill, mindgame, response time, whatsoever. Do you like to be 1 hit KOed? Well, i DON'T like it. And 1 HIT KO is a thing that are stuck on Priston Origins (Hello Pike). People that usually plays RPT have close minded to game balance concept as a whole, because imbalance is present since ever on Priston Tale. That's why people dont like it or do fake balance suggestion, aiming advantages for itself.

 

Again, what use is balancing weapons when you throw skills into the balance? So what if a pike gets lower attack on their weapon? You sit here q.qing about AC when CL hits THREE times at 66%. Also complaining FS got the 15% crit on AC? Ya, thats PASSIVE on pike. This is excluding things like assassin eye and vanish as well.

 

I think you didnt read it right. It was a example of a unfair fight with a 1 handed axe against 2 handed sword / scythe, leading to my question, 30 WEAPON atk damage or 10% critical? Don't forget 30 WEAPON atk damage is WAY noticeable, because all formulas start by your weapon. Personally if my job allow, i would pick wep dmg over critical.

 

Perhaps you're not bias, but if you're not, then I with many other people are wondering what you're smoking. All your ideas look at the narrowest possible viewpoint of a situation, exclude all the variables they're intertwined with, then make a simple conclusion to a much larger problem.

 

Excluding variables? This is something you can't say. Really. I do not say things without thinking and covering almost EVERY aspect of the game. You can see it clearly on all my suggestions that i've already did on this forum, regarding everything. To me, people QQ everyday about balance issue, what i'm trying is to balance the entire game as a whole, to reach a point when everyone is able to have fun without being frustrated by non-human levels (you've failed because of virtual reasons, not for your lack of playskill)

 

Sure, go balance your weapons, then we have to go doing even more balancing to skills. Things get nerfed, ppl q.q, and it's a huge mess to end up with the equivalent of where you started. Pointless work isn't something we need to be adding. Weapon imbalances are also very costly to the whole server, since they aren't automatically updated, you either have to find or buy a new one. Only severe imbalances need to be corrected on weapons because of this issue, such as the orbs vs shields and the bow vs other 2h problem.

 

Balancing skills is way more easier with balanced weapons, but, unlike you said that i'm excluding variables, with balanced gears, you're automatically excluding many things when doing balancing. Also, it isnt impossible to change a existing item on the game, what is happening is, Wartale doesn't have the tool or a script to do that. We're talking about Database, not the game itself. If he says that is IMPOSSIBLE to develop a script to change some values on the database, then i'll shut myself up. If you want to balance, you should do everything related on this matter.

 

To be honest, all i can see is people covering themselves, faking that they want balance the game, but they don't want to put their head on the table, they dont want to give up their overpower characterist for everyone else balance sake. I'll be a liar if i dont say that i dont do it, but, to prevent being impartial with my favourite class, i'm trying to hit other things that people usually don't notice, that i believe will help the balancing work as a whole. 

 

I'll just ask something, to everyone.

 

If you don't want to balance the game AS A WHOLE, assume the fact that you like unbalance. It's impossible to reach Balance without making each class more closer to one to another. This mean, making class gameplay a little more the same over all classes.

 

But that can be changed. My dream is when Realm PT would put a delay on every spammable skill, making other skills usefull, playing with combo of skills.

 

Do you think i like to just spam brandish or Grand Cross? No.

 

My dream is when i would be able to use almost every active skill of my character. The game can be balanced without making 8 versions of the same thing.

 

Sure. Pike can do it, comboing it's skills, but other class can not. What i want most is to use GC, DC, T2 Piercing, T4 Piercing, as a whole combo.

 

 

Off course this can require a lot of time. But, dream on your favorite game isn't prohibited.

Here is a question for you. What is the definition of unbalance? Obviously your the only 1 here who complain about weapon stats.

You said its not balance? Well guess what if it isn't then this topic should be made since ept/rpt/rpt. No 1 having trouble dealing with these weapon stats. Why are you?

[DarkLink64 921]

Read my thread and you will know why =D

[-assKICKER- 1]

NOTHING is wrong with weapons.

 

END

[4EvaLegend 0]

Read my thread and you will know why =D

Sorry GM not changing anything about the weapon stat not to make 1 person happy.

Obviously if he change it for you, im sure the whole server will want to change it back.

End of discussion lock topic.

[-assKICKER- 1]

But to your question, I got an easy answer. Mechs can use all meele weapons the same way. By your logic they should be all using axes, but what's the most common weapon among high level mechs? SWORDS!

 

u have just been PWNED!

[4EvaLegend 0]

But to your question, I got an easy answer. Mechs can use all meele weapons the same way. By your logic they should be all using axes, but what's the most common weapon among high level mechs? SWORDS!

 

u have just been PWNED!

good answer

[Zero 0]

@Link:

 

-Critical boosts the power of a skill by about 70%. When the base power of a CS ranges past 2.5-3k, you tell me if you want 30 extra base damage or the critical rate that will help you hit that +70% boost. What makes pike a terror is not just the overwhelming base power, but the insanity of their critical rate.

 

-We are balancing a game as a whole, it's you who refuse to. You try to keep it strictly about WEAPONS, when there are these things called skills which are based off of those. It isn't easier to keep skills balanced with the same weapons, since you've reduced the diversity of the game. How is reducing diversity going to get you less uniformity? Part of pike's supposed balance is also the highly variable damage of their main weapon. It should have a large range, since anything with as much power as they do will one shot too consistently if the minimum base is too high, or not kill often enough if the max isn't high enough. This is their weapon fitting them as a class to balance the game and not just to match the FS axe. Swords have higher critical and the classes that use them often have better AR, leading to more consisntcy that fits their playstyle. The list goes on quite a ways, but it is this line of thinking why weapons were not made the same.

 

-The problems with one shot pvp is the game was never built to handle PvP, it isn't because of weapons and nerfing them wouldn't change much. This game went for years without PvP, then the quick slap job they designed was only meant to hold a very limited range of levels which private servers far exceed. Attack has multipliers and defense doesn't, so it rapidly outgains defense the farther you go and this trend holds true for most games. With my 88 knight when BC came, I could tank like 6-7+ 7x's while being frozen by pikes/prs and still manage to live and get back to the flags. Here you can't even live almost any non-prs attacking you 1 on 1.

[Guest BloodBrothers]

Hello,

 

Can you stop making such a weird topics please, if you dont know how weapons works, then tell us we will help you,

 

Its not all about the weapons also about the skills your using with the weapons.....

 

Not close this topic please, and also DELETE YOUR FORUM ACOUNT oke thanks 8)

[Gogg 3]

I told him already to stop it and go back to bPT, countless times, but I still see him here calling me hater.

 

I'd like to know how that feels, defending knights so much, when I say they don't need anything, and in the end they don't get anything.

 

Or complaining so much about mechs and their problems, when they get multiple reviews, even though it's not fixed yet.

 

Or even more, saying I'm a fake member of my ex-clan when he's still a member, when I was vice leader of it back in time and left a lot of friends behind when he was called idiot by the old leader himself...

 

I guess he's calling me hater because I'm more popular than him even in the clan I left where he's still a member.

[DarkLink64 921]

I'm laughing so badly here. This community are so great! Look at that! Haha!

 

If you didn't agree, let your arguments and just get out of the thread. Simply.

 

I didn't ordered nothing or said that it will be done... I kinda don't know why so much hatred, haha!

 

 

 

Oh, and i'll do not delete my forum account. Not because a random worm people that doesn't know how to handle with different povs and opinions <3

[ponloa 0]

I'm laughing so badly here. This community are so great! Look at that! Haha!

 

If you didn't agree, let your arguments and just get out of the thread. Simply.

 

I didn't ordered nothing or said that it will be done... I kinda don't know why so much hatred, haha!

 

 

 

Oh, and i'll do not delete my forum account. Not because a random worm people that doesn't know how to handle with different povs and opinions <3

Opinions? Opinion. You are alone.

[Gogg 3]

See that, you're always trying something to make knights better than they already are. When people disagree with this and point out how silly it is, you play the victim, say that everyone hate you and do your little flame.

 

You can insist on all your dumb suggestions, but people can't insist on how bad they are? "Leave your arguments blablabla".

 

We're tired to see you trying to make knights overpowered over and over again.

[-assKICKER- 1]

I'm laughing so badly here. This community are so great! Look at that! Haha!

 

If you didn't agree, let your arguments and just get out of the thread. Simply.

 

I didn't ordered nothing or said that it will be done... I kinda don't know why so much hatred, haha!

 

 

 

Oh, and i'll do not delete my forum account. Not because a random worm people that doesn't know how to handle with different povs and opinions <3

 

don't laugh, nothing is funny, better if you could save your self, defend your arguments because you have been PWNED.

[elk24 0]

the 2 handed weapons are  balanced well enough

 

axe have small damage difference

sw has crt

hammer just have raw attack power

scythe have high max and high crt very large damage range if no crt

 

thats wut they are suppose to be since the start of  the game Pristontale. higher lvl weapons have all been put into raito from the lv1 weapons

 

the one weapon i think right now is too OP is 1 hand claws thou...

 

for a mech to be able to kill with 1 hand or at least deal constant crt damage, i feel thats a bit OP

 

IMO i wish Crt could be lower on claw or for a AR reduction on mech's skill GS

[Gogg 3]

Claws were always the best weapons by far, and just mechs really use them. Their critical is not a problem, problem is that Maximize is a total bug.

 

And mechs got the lowest attack rating of all non magic classes, already including the 200 atk rate added by GS. No sense make it lower.

 

 

That's why I'm against ANY change on mechs. People just complain about what they don't know. All those bugs should be fixed before these so-called "balance" that do nothing but screw the class all time.

[iagolealgames 9]

In my opinion it would be útel. But should study before for bit create  an OP weapon or a weak weapon.

 

A example of item were the orbs with the new

stats. The situation has changed and much for magicians and  pris.

 

Before they found themselves trapped in use shields to defend themselves (but still very little, because there is no shield spec mage or pris. )

[elk24 0]

Claws were always the best weapons by far, and just mechs really use them. Their critical is not a problem, problem is that Maximize is a total bug.

 

And mechs got the lowest attack rating of all non magic classes, already including the 200 atk rate added by GS. No sense make it lower.

 

 

That's why I'm against ANY change on mechs. People just complain about what they don't know. All those bugs should be fixed before these so-called "balance" that do nothing but screw the class all time.

 

lolz first of all GS adds 400 AR not 200 which is alot for a melee class

 

and you really arnt making a argument there... if MXi is bugged, how so? do u have the details?

 

just by saying its bugged doesnt make it so its ok for a class to be constantly OP, so i dun know wut u are talking about  ???.

 

 

and bug or no bug as of now mechs tank just fine but does too much damage, lowering crt or AR fixes this problem. it might be only temporary but still balances the class untill ur "bug" can be resolved

 

 

 

example:

 

before patch, Fs DT misses 1 hit KO 90%+ now with 320 added AR it now misses 1 hit KO by like 50%, all that with 320 AR increase.

[Gogg 3]

Mechs got the lowest damage of all meeles, with Maximize still lower than knights, GS is a lot weaker than AC, GC or CL, but I still manage to hitkill people way more often than other meeles with their spammable 1vs1 skill.

 

If something that got all to be lowest isn't the lowest, what is that?

 

LOL where do you get that info about GS attack rating? Please tell me you saw that ingame on a mech and not on the website.

 

Oh, and sorry, we don't like temporary nerfing to balace something until bugs are fixed. I don't remember any of you asking for a temporary boost when mechs were totally useless for over an year. Suck it up now. When they were bad nobody cares about bug fixing, now everyone hope for that. Go on and make it happen then, FIXING and not NERFING.

[QMan 0]

7 thing to for balancing

 

one weapon stat

two skill ability

three class formula

four donation power

five player ability

six lag ability

and seven..something maybe i forgot

 

all should balance together

i think topic own mean

"unfair with balancing with 1 hand and 2 hand weapon on each class"

 

no comment on how weapon balance for me

only suggest for development

 

it's easiest = focus balance on 1 thing(skill ability)