Tanking ability

[kaballfs 4]

So I've been away from the game for quite a long time, a year or so maybe, just got back, but something feels off...

 

I have a mech, he used to my "main" character back in the day, and I remember he being so tanky that I could tackle iron2 without the need for potions at all, at lvl 85, and being able to lvl there all the way to 100, then going to MD1 and being able to tackle there solo with some potions, but still pretty solid, but this was like years ago, I have deleted that and started from scratch, but still, he should be that tanky, no?

No, it seems... Either I'm stupid and my memory is garbage, or something changed, because 170abs used to be enough to tank everything between ds and ice1 without as much as a single hp potion, now I get stomped in iron2, pummeled in MD1, and so on with more than 200abs. What has changed?? What am I missing??? Sure I can tackle iron2 with some work, but it will be like lvling a knight or a fs, when it shouldn't.

 

If you need to know, my build is mainly a spark mech, for lvling and such, the difference being: Metal Armor is lvl 2, SS is lvl1 and golem is lvl 1, also I have more str than health. But this shouldn't be the issue, since 80% of less than 500def shouldn't add that much, also 240def + 2abs is nothing compared to the woping 118abs you get from PA and compulsion. My question remains: what has changed?

[toykiller2 0]

Ummm, Metal Armor and SS seem to be where it fails a bit. Unless you're currently not able to up them all.

 

PA is linked to Metal Armor, you get the best of both worlds there. For a spark build, you need more health and spirit, str to item req and you're laughing.

I believe Trine Shield (T5) stacks with SS, so look into using that too

 

Golem is useless for spark builds, Mag sphere would be better.

[kaballfs 4]

True enough. BUT, I did some math, and that doesn't seem to be the problem...

 

Metal Armor at 10 will give me about (probably less) 400def + 4abs, add 240def + 2abs from SS and you have 640def + 6abs from 2 skills, and if I'm not terribly mistaken, def prevents damage altogether, it's like evasion, it's a chance of taking no damage at all, while absoption reduces the final damage you took. So, bear with me: 640def + 6abs VS ~123abs and at least some damage to grind 1v1 maps, wich would you take?

Again, unless I'm terribly mistaken, I'm getting ~104def + 1abs from my MA and SS, but, I use MA with lvl 10 PA, so add 76abs, plus 42abs from compulsion, plus 4abs from shield (lvl 3 TS, don't remember abs from shield, should be about 12, wich makes it plus 4abs), so I get about 104def + 123abs, the trade in would be 640def + 128abs.

 

In the end it boils down to this: I have 212abs, ~1700def, ~700hp, I can tank iron2 but like a knight or fs, by kiting, and cannot tank MD1 at all (too much damage taken, can't pot, stunned to death), so what's the deal? What am I missing?? Is there a "minimum amount of damage you take regardless of your total abs" now? Has the absoption formula changed? I'm really confused.

 

I COULD go full tank, not a fan though, I do have points to get MA and SS to 10 and 9 respectively, also to get hp to about 2k, still, that wouldn't make too much of a difference, it would be like playing as prs, and for that, I could just play prs.

[toykiller2 0]

You've got be stumped. With those stats, Iron2 should be fairly easy... MD1 was a lil rough when I got there, but I could manage it.

 

Absorb Formula

 

For each item with abs equipped you get +0.5 abs extra on top of the abs of that item

100 def = 1 abs

40 strength = 1 abs

40 spirit = 1 abs

40 talent = 1 abs (and 40 talent = 10def = +0.1 abs) = 1.1 abs

40 agility = 0 abs (and 40 agility = 40def = +0.4 abs) = 0.4 abs

40 health = 1 abs

10 lvl = 1 abs (and 10 lvl = 14def = +0.14 abs) = 1.14 abs

1 abs point extra = 1 abs

Note: If you have 7.124 abs you will get 7 abs

Note: The final received damage is subtracted with your abs

 

Full tank is an option towards later levels, Spark's about the best build you can go for leveling.

[kaballfs 4]

EXACTLY, iron2 should be easy, it's not so. SO, what gives? What is wrong?

[maktub 2]

EXACTLY, iron2 should be easy, it's not so. SO, what gives? What is wrong?

 

The skill balance requires more atention and certainly is not right yet... My mech is Auto so I'm not feeling the loss of abs

because it was already low, however playing my main char wich is a Mage it's not enjoyable anymore because both of them

are " Mana Addict " But the ranged one still playable.

 

 

[toykiller2 0]

I know this won't be a fair test due to levels, but I just want to iron2 with my 120 mech, no skills and tanked fine.

Most of my items are inferna and enigma mixes, which helps.

 

Def: 2189

Abs: 140

Blk: 29.5%

Hp: 1467

Mp: 1037

 

Am trying to think of a way to "mirror" your char to compare... Even if I get lower items, level diff will still remain and that will affect the testing.

 

Edited with new testing idea*

 

Ok, retested with a MS Long sword and no skills running;

 

Def: 1750

Abs: 112

Blk: 5%

Hp: 1437

Mp: 996

 

I found my hp dropping (no surprise there), but was still able to tank and kill with ease, as long as I watch my health.

Health: 370

Str: 136 (Req for shield)

Spr: 210

 

212abs, ~1700def, ~700hp

Gunna say that you might have to much in Str which could be put into Health, providing more hp, abs

[sotkulaja 4]

it's got to be some kind of a bug. my shaman, with 1700def(142abs), at lvl 108, takes almost no dmg (some ofcourse) in MD1. I could tank iron2 with ease with less than 1300def(112abs). Although it is a different character, the def and abs are not the issue here. It is probably either that the character is bugged for some reason or the lvl of the character now makes that much of a difference, which I think it should not. Just shooting ideas here. Have a 8x mech myself but not tried it in iron2

[toykiller2 0]

Level does make a difference and it's fairly easy to see.

 

For example, when I tested with the Long sword (4% blk + 1% from Vamp armor = 5% total) I still had Block popping up a lot, not as much as wearing a shield 

It even happens with Defence, the higher your level to the target's level, the more likely it is to pop up.

[sotkulaja 4]

ok, good to know. But does it now have more of an effect than before?

[kaballfs 4]

#toykiller2

Thanks for the help.

As I said, I can tank it, but with kiting, wich is not ideal, but I can. I'll have to run some testing, but something is definitely off, with less abs you could tackle it.

On other stuff, str and health give both the same amount of abs, only difference being 0.8hp per str and 2.4hp per health. Gonna try more health, maybe get a claw, switch armor, something has to work.

 

#sotkulaja

Probably, since before my absence I was able to tank iron2 without the need for potions, as in my hp regen was bigger than the dmg I took, and my hp regen is 3/s or so.

 

Thanks everyone.

 

#Edit:

Just did some testing, found the culprit: Gaia Armor.

I was using it since it is fairly better than a Minotaur (i'm not rich, can't afford better ones, can't find also), BUT, for some awkward reason while using it my buffs didn't work at all, so no +def, no +abs, no + nothing, it was like fighting without skills, so I bought and speced a Minotaur, I had a 4abs and 150def drop, BUT, I can tank iron2 again and without potions, my hp regen is bigger than dmg delt.

 

So, let this be testimony that Gaia Armor is somewhat bugged.

[sotkulaja 4]

doesnt gaia armor have a mech spec when you get it from the quest? sounds like a bug?

 

edits: could have read the whole post above too, and not post this useless comment oh well

[toykiller2 0]

Man, I feel like a fool! *lol* I had assumed you had the right gear for your level and focused on stats/skills!

 

Gaia armor should've worked fine, unless not MS spec, which it's sounding like.

Will take a trip through my mules later, I need my morning coffee, and see if I've kept any old items.

 

Health beats Str for a Spark mech, claw will help with a lil def.

[kaballfs 4]

#toykiller2

Do not feel that way, it is a mech spec, it's the one I got from the quest, has a good mix as well, but it's bugged, I wouldn't ask for anything if it wasn't mech spec to begin with, because without it I can't even use MA... So, yeah, don't feel bad, game's bugged. Also, the rest is decent for my lvl, all 80 gear mech spec with mix/age, except for weapon, wich is 90, and ring/amulet wich are 60 and 70.

 

edit: the way it was is like this, using a mech spec armor (and pretty much everything else, I think my bracer is not, I may be wrong though) I was using MA, SS, Compulsion, orb and TS, BUT, there were no effect whatsoever, I got those stats I said before (212abs, ~1700def, ~700hp) and still took hard hits, now I have ditched Gaia and traded for a mediocre Minotaur (total 210abs, ~1500def~) BUT I'm tanking considerably better. To be clear, my Gaia Armor IS mech spec