PHoenix Speed

[benitez123 32]

What are the changes they made to AS phoenix speed? Can't seem to see the difference.

[sandro 1]

2 hours ago, benitez123 said:

What are the changes they made to AS phoenix speed? Can't seem to see the difference.

Evade not work correctly.

[benitez123 32]

LOL! This topic was made because I want to know what changes they made to Phoenix Speed as I do not have the stats before it was change.

[benitez123 32]

7 hours ago, sandro said:

Evade not work correctly.

So before the change, the added evasion doesn't works? I see. Thanks!

 

[sandro 1]

On 2017-4-30 at 1:35 PM, KriKa. said:

Evade work as well LOL why you guys complaim ? hollyshit lol

Evade still working as well archer still tanking as well

 

I think you guys wanna archer tank like as mech tanker/full hp and kill like archer pure

 

others class need balance and no one comment about it, why? afraid? '-'

 

you read well what i wrote?

 

23 % Evade Master + 26 % Phoenix Speed = 49% Evade

 

Playing i see more block than evade.

[kenibok 1,059]

On 30/4/2017 at 8:47 AM, benitez123 said:

What are the changes they made to AS phoenix speed? Can't seem to see the difference.

On lv 10 It used to be           Now

+19 running speed               +18 running speed

+30% evasion                       +26% evasion

-30% ATK rating                    -40% ATK rating

2x Stamina req                      2x Stamina req

 

About the way evasion was added or worked I had no idea it was wrong in any way o.o

On 30/4/2017 at 2:35 PM, KriKa. said:

Evade work as well LOL why you guys complaim ? hollyshit lol

Evade still working as well archer still tanking as well

 

I think you guys wanna archer tank like as mech tanker/full hp and kill like archer pure

 

others class need balance and no one comment about it, why? afraid? '-'

 

I dont really think someone is complaining. At least not them.

There wasn't really any suggestions about... anything

Thats actually a good point, a lot of people have ideas that could help on balancing, but Im quite sure the topic "Phoenix Speed" doesn't really have much to do with any other class but.. Archer. Not exactly the right topic

sound kind of agressive, anyways maybe Im misunderstanding

 

On 30/4/2017 at 11:37 AM, sandro said:

Evade not work correctly.

How did it not work? It wasn't being added?

Edited May 4, 2017 by kenibok

[Wartale 7,375]

There's a bug with Phoenix Shot => it doesn't miss. This will be fixed in the next patch.

[kenibok 1,059]

21 hours ago, Wartale said:

There's a bug with Phoenix Shot => it doesn't miss. This will be fixed in the next patch.

('◉⌓◉’) Please don't. Archer just lost about 60% to 70% of its ATK rtg with the last patch: avalanche misses more now, making -archers main role -hunting- harder, I honestly think allowing phoenix shot (which is basically archers main skill for everything) to miss will make things a lot harder, I believe this change is going to hurt more than help.

[Saikan 1]

6 hours ago, kenibok said:

('◉⌓◉’) Please don't. Archer just lost about 60% to 70% of its ATK rtg with the last patch: avalanche misses more now, making -archers main role -hunting- harder, I honestly think allowing phoenix shot (which is basically archers main skill for everything) to miss will make things a lot harder, I believe this change is going to hurt more than help.

hey, actually phoenix shot need to be nerfed, it's very op in bc since it don't miss, you can't defend it (only evade,block). 

For hunting with archers try skill bomb shot lvl 10, it's a really good skill for hunting (or it used to be, didn't test it after this patch)

[Robin564 11]

• Change evade+atk rtg and change phoenix shot= Archer useless >.< change back and fix phoenix shot always hit and its solved 

[Saikan 1]

50 minutes ago, Robin564 said:

• Change evade+atk rtg and change phoenix shot= Archer useless >.< change back and fix phoenix shot always hit and its solved 

notes: even with evade reduced u can still reach the maximum evade % in server.  atk rtg was really high, now it's normal, just like before. phoenix shot need changes so that it can miss.

obs: archers will never ever be useless, just make a new build for the changes 

[Robin564 11]

I dont think its OP now in bc not at all since changes unless you use all buffs from all diff chars wich all classes gets that way if you reduce atk rtg this much and now does so PS miss then it wont hit at all = useless so i mean fix back old atk rtg and make it able to miss ^^

[kenibok 1,059]

4 hours ago, Saikan said:

hey, actually phoenix shot need to be nerfed, it's very op in bc since it don't miss, you can't defend it (only evade,block). 

For hunting with archers try skill bomb shot lvl 10, it's a really good skill for hunting (or it used to be, didn't test it after this patch)

On bc almost no one dies of 1 ph, not even 2, archer vs archer may die of hit and bad equipped. Make it like perforation, allow it to be defended. I still don't think making it miss will help.

bomb shot is an absolutely perfect skill for hunting, but its only worth against Demon monster type (3x damage). It has 6 atk speed no matter weapon speed, summer bonus or mix, it's not really an option for other monster type.

[Saikan 1]

4 minutes ago, kenibok said:

On bc almost no one dies of 1 ph, not even 2, archer vs archer may die of hit and bad equipped. Make it like perforation, allow it to be defended. I still don't think making it miss will help.

bomb shot is an absolutely perfect skill for hunting, but its only worth against Demon monster type (3x damage). It has 6 atk speed no matter weapon speed, summer bonus or mix, it's not really an option for other monster type.

no one dies for 1 ph or 2? sorry but you don't go bc ^^ I play in one as 153 for months and i know what i'm saying. i can hit kill some players.
about bomb shot for other monsters type, just test it. before the new patch i've tested perforation, bomb shot and phoenix shot and believe in me bomb shot was better than perforation and just a little lower dmg compared to phoenix shot

[Robin564 11]

8 minutes ago, Saikan said:

no one dies for 1 ph or 2? sorry but you don't go bc ^^ I play in one as 153 for months and i know what i'm saying. i can hit kill some players.
about bomb shot for other monsters type, just test it. before the new patch i've tested perforation, bomb shot and phoenix shot and believe in me bomb shot was better than perforation and just a little lower dmg compared to phoenix shot

I am 148 archer i dont 1 hit anything even with 100% pure build unless its another pure archer or auto ms "yes 100% full dnt +22" *-*

[kenibok 1,059]

9 hours ago, Saikan said:

no one dies for 1 ph or 2? sorry but you don't go bc ^^ I play in one as 153 for months and i know what i'm saying. i can hit kill some players.
about bomb shot for other monsters type, just test it. before the new patch i've tested perforation, bomb shot and phoenix shot and believe in me bomb shot was better than perforation and just a little lower dmg compared to phoenix shot

I forgive you... I guess(?). I do go to bc, not all day tho. Archers don't kill of 1 or 2 ph even on the best pure build, not even other archer. Archer does not have hitkill skill unlike ps/ata or other classes and Im not suggesting that they should or not.

Tell me do you hitkill a 153 ms? Not the best comparison, right?

Honestly I don't think using perforation for hunting is the best choice, neither bomb shot, unless its demon: attacking with avalanche you get 6x73% (438%) with a speed of 14-15 each hit, while bomb shot hits 2x100% (vs all but demon) with 6 speed no matter what. On the time you make 1 avalanche you can make around 1,5(-) bomb shot. Not worth it. If you are talking about drop party, they are basically SL, and thats way a reduced use for archers hunting.

 

9 hours ago, Robin564 said:

I am 148 archer i dont 1 hit anything even with 100% pure build unless its another pure archer or auto ms "yes 100% full dnt +22" *-*

Exactly, that's the point, compare yourself to same or close level opponents. Probably you (or any 15x+) easily kill a 13x or lower lvl char, an auto-ms or a really bad equipped archer/ata/ass-> low hp char and yeah, mules, but surely not a char thats similar to you (level, equips quality, no matter class). 

btw, even for those "weaker" chars you have time to pot in 2 ph's if you are paying attention.

 

Archer's attack should be high (as it is), and they are paper weak. Archers basically survive PvE and PvP by their possibilty of not receiving hits (evasion,block, wolverine, etc) but when they do, their chance to survive is low. HP goes down drastically. 

Unlike atalantas, for example, which are supposed to resist more than archer, but attack less.

[[BlackMagician] 4]

hahahaa noob talking about buff AS... you guys never go bc or dont have idea how to play in bc.

 

One archer can kill in bc 1 Shot and tank like a mech, but you guys never go bc, only 15mins or 30mins and no have idea what happend.

 

Archer need nerf.

 

Stop complain, you want hunt and kill easy with whatever char, PS cant hunt and no one complains.

People say-- "Ms cant make sod", i have ms and i do 11kk gold per SOD, because i know how to play, if you know how to play with one char, you can do whatever you want.

 

[kenibok 1,059]

58 minutes ago, [BlackMagician] said:

hahahaa noob talking about buff AS... you guys never go bc or dont have idea how to play in bc.

 

One archer can kill in bc 1 Shot and tank like a mech, but you guys never go bc, only 15mins or 30mins and no have idea what happend.

 

Archer need nerf.

 

Stop complain, you want hunt and kill easy with whatever char, PS cant hunt and no one complains.

People say-- "Ms cant make sod", i have ms and i do 11kk gold per SOD, because i know how to play, if you know how to play with one char, you can do whatever you want.

 

-? what    what am I even supposed to say?

Um?, focus, (not Robin564, not me, guess that means "you guys") no one even suggested most of what you just wrote, don't change or disperse the subject just leads nowhere.

You are sort of right, most people is not complaining about ps hunt current state but searching and proposing solutions about it. Check Townsquare>Suggestions  there are 2 topics about pikeman's hunt issue, same for Character Strategies>Pikeman.

 

I still stand on the things I wrote

@Wartale GM I would like you to re-consider the Phoenix Shot changes or the ATK rig reduction.

I think balance can and should be made more about benefits and improvements for each class instead of reductions and limitations of the actual state of these.

 

ps: chill out

[kenibok 1,059]

Guys I think it is not about pointing what the other class has or is good for, as a bad thing. They all have pros and cons, the other class is always gonna be better at something than the other, cause that's the way they are supposed to be; not saying that some should not be fixed, cause they do, but not everything that is being pointed are real problems. Its a game and this differences create complement, partyQs, strategies-> create game interactions, sociability. Do not spect a fighter to tank as a mech, atas with the critical of assassins or idk pris as best hunters, I mean they need a boost on that but not to kill like auto-ms. If you think you have a better idea of how it should be fixed, show it, maybe you do.

[Robin564 11]

You cant 1 hit someone with your gear and lvl not even 100% pure build just as i said you just cant but well what do i know i just live in bc like litterly, but its nice to see that 158 archer cant 1 hit but that 153 can gg xD

Edited May 4, 2017 by Robin564

[Saikan 1]

you guys are funny. i have alot of experience about archer in this server and in my opnion i have one of the best build for pvp. about pvp, archers can tank very well with thales build or armor build and still kill. the changes for phoenix speed and golden falcon was needed since the atk rtg was really high (10k+ atk rtg? really?).

about bomb shot again! did you test it taking note the time that you need to kill one mob in sl? if not, do it, i tested it and in my opnion bomb shot is really worth for hunting (before new patch, didn't test in this patch!).

about phoenix shot, "There's a bug with Phoenix Shot => it doesn't miss. This will be fixed in the next patch." all 1v1 skills can miss so why phoenix shot should be special and keep never missing (sure it can be blocked and evaded but what about the defense?)?

about atk rtg, it received a big debuff in this patch, i'll leave my suggestion here: @Wartale

 

before patch the atk rtg buff was (100% stack scout hawk - 30% phoenix speed = 70%) but now it's (50% stack scout hawk - 40% phoenix speed = 10%), that's a really big debuff, in my opnion since golden falcon was reduced by 50%, phoenix speed shouldn't've received a -10% debuff, it should stay as -30% atk rtg or make golden falcon stack 60% since in pve archers don't use phoenix speed.

[lhyamauti 56]

As and mage need Nerf.

Can kill everyone so easy, and as with Shield, tank like a Mech.

Edited May 4, 2017 by lhyamauti

[kenibok 1,059]

3 hours ago, Saikan said:

you guys are funny. i have alot of experience about archer in this server and in my opnion i have one of the best build for pvp. about pvp, archers can tank very well with thales build or armor build and still kill. the changes for phoenix speed and golden falcon was needed since the atk rtg was really high (10k+ atk rtg? really?).

about bomb shot again! did you test it taking note the time that you need to kill one mob in sl? if not, do it, i tested it and in my opnion bomb shot is really worth for hunting (before new patch, didn't test in this patch!).

about phoenix shot, "There's a bug with Phoenix Shot => it doesn't miss. This will be fixed in the next patch." all 1v1 skills can miss so why phoenix shot should be special and keep never missing (sure it can be blocked and evaded but what about the defense?)?

about atk rtg, it received a big debuff in this patch, i'll leave my suggestion here: @Wartale

 

before patch the atk rtg buff was (100% stack scout hawk - 30% phoenix speed = 70%) but now it's (50% stack scout hawk - 40% phoenix speed = 10%), that's a really big debuff, in my opnion since golden falcon was reduced by 50%, phoenix speed shouldn't've received a -10% debuff, it should stay as -30% atk rtg or make golden falcon stack 60% since in pve archers don't use phoenix speed.

Um, thank you, but talking about me, Im not trying to be funny really

GoldenFalcon and Scout Hawk used to chain 200% (not 100%) and they chain 50% now (75% reduction), that, plus -10% ATK rtg, meaning exactly what you said, getting a bonus of only 10%. This leaves the both skills chain almost useless, you get 15 HP regen, and I think thats what red roses are for. I think changing to a 100% chain will give an adequate bonus, not excessive actually. With a fixed rtg I don't think ph missing would hurt that bad.

I already mentioned that point. SL party hunting is a small part of Archer's hunting ability, do not reduce the situation to the way you hunt. It simply does not represent Archer's hunting. You know there's players that actually solo hunt or 12x, 13x and 14x archer players that don't go to SL, cause (they can't or) there are other hunt maps too; it involves a lot more. I know, unbelievable.

Bomb Shot is the absolute skill for demons and its very good for mass attacking, but 1vs1 no-demon-monster, honestly truly, I don't think so, just compare %. Why use bomb shot when you have Ph: faster and a lot more powerful, and 10% more MP and SP usage. Im sure there are better skills for 1vs1 but if you really think its the way you say, test it, maybe you have a point

[Saikan 1]

31 minutes ago, kenibok said:

I already mentioned that point. SL party hunting is a small part of Archer's hunting ability, do not reduce the situation to the way you hunt. It simply does not represent Archer's hunting. You know there's players that actually solo hunt or 12x, 13x and 14x archer players that don't go to SL, cause (they can't or) there are other hunt maps too; it involves a lot more. I know, unbelievable.

Bomb Shot is the absolute skill for demons and its very good for mass attacking, but 1vs1 no-demon-monster, honestly truly, I don't think so, just compare %. Why use bomb shot when you have Ph: faster and a lot more powerful, and 10% more MP and SP usage. Im sure there are better skills for 1vs1 but if you really think its the way you say, test it, maybe you have a point

so, you don't believe in me right? i went just now to SL and tested Phoenix Shot and Bomb Shot in the same mob 1vs1 (NOT HS, NOT PARTY!) the mob was Undead Chemist
Bomb Shot Time to Kill the Mob > 1 minute and 35 seconds
Phoenix Shot Time to Kill the Mob > 1 minute and 25 seconds.

as you see, there is not so much diference between them. Note: you are taking in account just the % of the dmg but aren't you forgetting about the fixed splash damage? For the mob targeted, bomb shot gives 100% + 250-500 splash dmg and for the other mobs near it gives just 250-500 dmg. that's why i'm saying that bomb shot is a really good skill for hunting. 

note: used as 153 pure with succubus for this test.

[Robin564 11]

I dont care about either if they change PS wich i have no problem with they need to boost the atk rtg again its super low atm